Why are we dumbing down HipHop?

[ManDAmyth]

I don't buy the dumbing down of society. The majority of people swallowing up this bullshit music are actually middle to upper class teens getting some of the best education in the world.

I do agree society is dumbing down, but the consumers off this music are not.

The artist bare a blunt of the responsibility. They are the ones creating the music and (mainstream artists) are not providing any alternative to this "D-Boy" junk.

Consumers can only buy music that is available to be purchased and who is responsible for creating that music? The artists.

DJ's also play a huge real in the current mess. As Sean Price puts it,

"Call dude at the radio, listen could you play me yo?
Yeah I'ma play it, he ain't play it but he played me though"

Unless your putting money in a dj's pocket they aren't going to spin your shit, unless it's college of course.

DJ's don't break new music anymore they just play what's safe, and what comes with a couple greenbacks attached to it.

Onced exposed to the real hip hop that is being made in all regions of the country and globe.... people will buy it.

My 17 year old sister in law heard me bumping Sean Price's Monkey Bars one day. Even though all she listened to before was Souljah Boy, Lil Jon and Brittney Spears stuff... she went out the next time she got paid and bought Sean Price's shit and her favorite track is "Onion Heads" to top it off.

She's always asked me to burn and has even stolen many of my cd's. She always asks, "How do you hear about these people? Why don't the play this stuff on the radio?"

I have no answer.

Speaking of dumbing down hip hop. Isn't it the dumbest shit in the world that Def Squad is not on Def Jam.

I actually remember about 10 years ago thinking to myself if there's every a time Erick Sermon, Keith Murray and Redman aren't on Def Jam, Hip Hop would be in a bad place.

And here we are.

 

[LDB]

why did you mention it?

..and no, I don't believe that to be true. Ill is crazy diverse.

Out of everything that I've said and have been saying you slice, dice and quote that....please! lmbao
I'm not trying to persuade you or anybody else...I'm just speaking my mind like everyone else.

 

[ManDAmyth]

This south is more then capable of bringing real hip hop back.

There are currently artists making real hip hop in the south.

Rich Boy is one. I was real skeptical but I literally haven't stopped listening to his album since I put it in.

The south is in a position to take Hip Hop from the clutches of corporations and bring it back to the streets.

Speaking of international hip hp acts. What happened to the "Creators"??? 2Good??

I know one of them runs a dope website that sells rare records.

 

[LDB]

This south is more then capable of bringing real hip hop back.

There are currently artists making real hip hop in the south.

The south is in a position to take Hip Hop from the clutches of corporations and bring it back to the streets.

Speaking of international hip hp acts. What happened to the "Creators"??? 2Good??

I know one of them runs a dope website that sells rare records.

True....the south is more than capable. I can definitely see it get back on track in a whole other country though. Before this year you had never seen EU emcees doing it big on the BET awards. That's proof that the industry is looking elsewhere for some profits. Hell, there money is already worth more than ours. It's not a far fetched idea at all!

 

[StressWon]

Out of everything that I've said and have been saying you slice, dice and quote that....please! lmbao
I'm not trying to persuade you or anybody else...I'm just speaking my mind like everyone else.

I was just wonderin what that has to do wit the topis. I'm just sayin,,,speak ya mind. It's all gravy. Please nuttin man, I get it. But you right, let's get back on topic,,,my fault,,,LMWAO


I don't hate the south. I hate ignorant artists. And man,,they from all over. The south could being it back, but it's the same no matter the coast or location. It's the fan base. White Suburbia. Mufuccas that think it's cool to sell drugs, hold heat, and pimp hoes. Why? Cause they never seen that before. They don't know the struggle. But to be real,,,it's the labels fault. At the end of the day, they tellin you how to spit. It ain't right. It's the rich exec in the office knowin his 14 year old dauhter in private school knows every word to "This is why I'm hot". Like I said, I don't hate the south,,I hate the industry.

 

[classic]

For those who dont know, i grew up in the south my family is from the south...I belive that the south is the birthplace of black culture(which is now popular culture ) in this country, period hands down...WIthout the south there is No AMERICAN music, i mean NOTHING....
(ragtime,blues, jazz ,rock ,soul ,funk, disco, hiphop......)


I doubt there are that many people on this site who can match my knowedege of southern hip hop or southen music culture in general... basically im a true fan... I dont wanna boast but i think that knowing my history will give some knowlege to my position

To the point........ BEing that im a true fan and on grownd level means that im able to reconize the problems.. Now lil drama... you keep getting defensive thinking that people are attacking your position. THats not the case (atleast not for me.) Now i will say that alot of people in this thread and on this site are speaking out of pure ignorants when it comes to southern hip hop(most cats werent aware of it besides a couple big names back in 97,98) but im not one of them....

You cannot sit there and tell me that the south is not in a position of power right now... Who ever holds the soo called "throne"in hip hop can agree that right now and for the past six years the south is on top... Now of course we know major lables pimp artists and we know they look for cats with radio play and trendy hits.. but thats true of any region when its at its prime....

Evenually you have to put the blame on the actual artist not trying to break a new sound or diversivefy.. RIght now southern hip hop is probolly only 1/10 as diverse as it was 6 or 7 years ago(mainstream wise)... but its also become 10 times as popular.The last mainstream southern artists to break a new sound was lil john and that was damn near 6 years ago... And that sound is STILL being recycled and thrown down our necks... Look at whats coming out of the south right now and getting radio play...It ALL sounds the same.. its either D-boy...or a new dance... now im not hating on either.. but where is the Other aspect of southern hip hop that was prevelent untill this new found power. Where are the "grown ass men" in southern hip hop
ll tell you where... they bounced and jumped ship right before we hit the jackpot...SO now we have a bunch of young dudes literally in it for the buck... no artistry no "hip hop" in there blood.. its more about the dance and the cheese...

Now becasue the south is in a position where everybody is trying to copy them... Look whats being copied...Are the Outkast's the goodie mobbs, hell even the luda's being copyied by other regions right now... NO. Its crunk to dance, dance to hyphy, hyphy to something else....bascially we are really setting ourselves up for a huge backlash.. and it will happen...

Its ok for another region to copy and waterd down a style that we created a while ago... but the problem is that WE are still doing it!!!!!!

 

[Relic]

Only reason I mention the south is because Im living in it and my paticular city has an F'd up market, thats the only thing Im hating on southernwise, and I believe I stated earlier that there are an ass of wise mc's here that cant get ahead because the guys who pick whos next only want "The minstrel" thats what frustrates me..
Theres PLENTY of Ignant shit commin outta NYC and elsewhere as well.
My point is overall is to everybody smartin up ya shit.
Hadnt disagreed with you once LDB. lol

this is a good thread, but lets try and focus on dumb hiphop and its root causes and potential fixes instead of the pack attacking itself. mmmmkay?

 

[LDB]

Classic, I'm sure you'll get a lot of fan fare for spittin' that but I humbly don't agree with a lot of it. And stop saying I'm getting all defensive. You don't know me like that. I'm in the luxury of my home chillin' and typing. Words from across the globe or country will never get me aggie like that. I'm a grown ass man with real life problems facing me on a daily so this net shit is no more than stress relief and fun in the form of text. So chill with that. I've said before on these threads that you can't check a dudes emotional state from text so stop trying.

I believe in the statement "it ain't where you're from it's where you're at"! You're in New York, you visit the Fla. on occasion I'm sure. I'm not knocking you for it, I'm just saying. Your history spill may be on point but your "right now" is not. I'm telling you and everybody else here that you can't bottle the south up because of what you hear being blazed on the air waves of "your" local radio station. I'm in these hole in the wall clubs that do nothing but showcase artist like the Royal Peacock. I'm not hearing 1/10 of what you hear on the Radio in these streets. Mind you it's not all political and conscious music but most of it is good music. Everybody's not down with political issues, everybody's not down with being a street prophet. Some just do fun music and there's nothing wrong with that.

I'm not going to go back and forth with you on this. I respect your stance.....do the same and respect mine. Leave the personal jabs out of it and don't assume anything.

Only reason I mention the south is because Im living in it and my paticular city has an F'd up market, thats the only thing Im hating on southernwise, and I believe I stated earlier that there are an ass of wise mc's here that cant get ahead because the guys who pick whos next only want "The minstrel" thats what frustrates me..
Theres PLENTY of Ignant shit commin outta NYC and elsewhere as well.
My point is overall is to everybody smartin up ya shit.
Hadnt disagreed with you once LDB. lol

this is a good thread, but lets try and focus on dumb hiphop and its root causes and potential fixes instead of the pack attacking itself. mmmmkay?

I'm with u Relic. I respect your stance. "You're" in the south so you're speaking from the battlefield. There's a lot of Step childs out there and others doing music that may not be as conscious. People need to just stop taking shots at the south based on what they hear on the radio is all I'm really saying. I don't go there unless somebody takes me there. Some cats just feel the need to quote people or shout out there name, dissect there statements and point out one little thing in the midst of a paragraph of shit. Some do it just to strengthen there stance while others do it in hopes that others will pile on. It's funny and corny at the same time because I personally don't require back up when it comes to speaking my mind in these threads. I'm not trying to rally the troops. I'm just being me!

 

[Relic]

SO how shall we, as a nation, stop the dumbing down of hiphop?

Shoot up all the labels and program directors..

 

[Ash Holmz]

I was just wonderin what that has to do wit the topis. I'm just sayin,,,speak ya mind. It's all gravy. Please nuttin man, I get it. But you right, let's get back on topic,,,my fault,,,LMWAO


I don't hate the south. I hate ignorant artists. And man,,they from all over. The south could being it back, but it's the same no matter the coast or location. It's the fan base. White Suburbia. Mufuccas that think it's cool to sell drugs, hold heat, and pimp hoes. Why? Cause they never seen that before. They don't know the struggle. But to be real,,,it's the labels fault. At the end of the day, they tellin you how to spit. It ain't right. It's the rich exec in the office knowin his 14 year old dauhter in private school knows every word to "This is why I'm hot". Like I said, I don't hate the south,,I hate the industry.

lol .. an unborn child could learn the words to this is why im hot .... and artists like him are prolly the biggest part of the problem as well.. he is a new york nigga with the most dumbed-down idiot flow ive heard across the board... he is a poser, i actually heard some shit form him back in the day where his flow sounded like a second rate jay-z .. now he sound like a second rate young joc, which is pretty hard to accomplish because young joc is fuckin terrible lol... staying current/ahead of the curve is diffrent than hoping on bandwagons and following whatever the latest trend is.

 

[Relic]

lol .. an unborn child could learn the words to this is why im hot .... and artists like him are prolly the biggest part of the problem as well.. he is a new york nigga with the most dumbed-down idiot flow ive heard across the board... he is a poser, i actually heard some shit form him back in the day where his flow sounded like a second rate jay-z .. now he sound like a second rate young joc, which is pretty hard to accomplish because young joc is fuckin terrible lol... staying current/ahead of the curve is diffrent than hoping on bandwagons and following whatever the latest trend is.

I think in the second line of that song he says that the song and flow is garbage lol, only reason I didnt Hate on it as hard as some.Its like a subliminal "help me!" line lol.
Somthin like I can make a mil sayin nothin on the mic ...Crafty there.

 

[Sonorous]

I think its 50% artist’s 25% record labels and 25% public. But the artists has to take a stand and not put out bullshit just to please the A&R, who a mountain climber who plays an electric guitar, I know it a business and you have to make money. This falls back on the public who buys that bullshit the artist puts out making a market for that bullshit. But on an overall it’s not just the lyric its there whole appearance and they wonder why Oprah don’t want them on her show.

 

[ManDAmyth]

I'm telling you and everybody else here that you can't bottle the south up because of what you hear being blazed on the air waves of "your" local radio station. I'm in these hole in the wall clubs that do nothing but showcase artist like the Royal Peacock. I'm not hearing 1/10 of what you hear on the Radio in these streets. Mind you it's not all political and conscious music but most of it is good music. Everybody's not down with political issues, everybody's not down with being a street prophet. Some just do fun music and there's nothing wrong with that.

I love good music. Would you mind putting me onto some heads that aren't getting shine in the national limelight but are nonetheless making good music in the south?

I love looking out for new music and following people's career's from day one.

Bet I'll be checking out the Royal Peacock.

Good music still spreads via word of mouth.

One of the dopest things about the internet is that I can interact with heads all over the country.

I purchased Eminem's Infinite and Just Don't Give A Fuck EP's well before he ever hooked up with Dre because of interacting with heads on a forum.

 

[Vice]

I blame Akon... Not because I don't like his music, well because I blame for everything since that "put the blame on me" song he put out....lol..

nah for real, I believe that more than the artist or even the record labels, Hip Hop's "Dumbing" comes from the consumer. Lets face it, people are stupid. Nobody wants to hear anything like positive music when your in the club. I mean, when I used to go to clubs it made me like songs that I wouldn't go out and buy...like Nelly and Cash Money... because number one I was drunk, and number 2 I liked when the woman got half naked... That was back then and I look at the state of "Hip Hop" now and see that it just reflects the consumer. And I put Hip Hop in qoutations because I don't consider what the radio people do hip hop. I consider it more POP or Rap. It is it's own genre now to me...It's sad but the majority of people buying albums are...well....retarded.

 

[LDB]

I love good music. Would you mind putting me onto some heads that aren't getting shine in the national limelight but are nonetheless making good music in the south?

I love looking out for new music and following people's career's from day one.

Bet I'll be checking out the Royal Peacock.

Good music still spreads via word of mouth.

One of the dopest things about the internet is that I can interact with heads all over the country.

I purchased Eminem's Infinite and Just Don't Give A Fuck EP's well before he ever hooked up with Dre because of interacting with heads on a forum.

For a start check out this guy MALACHI. He just signed with Organized Noise. I performed in a fashion show with him this past Saturday. His stage show is unbelievable. www.myspace.com/atlhboy

 

[Relic]

I love good music. Would you mind putting me onto some heads that aren't getting shine in the national limelight but are nonetheless making good music in the south?

I love looking out for new music and following people's career's from day one.

Bet I'll be checking out the Royal Peacock.

Good music still spreads via word of mouth.

One of the dopest things about the internet is that I can interact with heads all over the country.

I purchased Eminem's Infinite and Just Don't Give A Fuck EP's well before he ever hooked up with Dre because of interacting with heads on a forum.

StepChild *shamless plug*

ViceVerse- I swear I wont tell your fans you said that!

 

[Krazyfingaz]

if you really wanna look at it in a simple way or if anyone wants to place the blame, than balme yourself or better yet the consumer who buys Hip Hop records cause if anyone of us go to a record store and really look for "Real Hip Hop" records you will find that "Real Hip Hop" artist and great music (not including backpack artist i.e. asop rock to pack fm) still does exist. People just choose to go for what alot of us consider bullshit music. the problem is not with the south like I and many have said before cause if you look at New York, Jerz and Philly, alot of those cats are running with the south's style or "swagger" when it comes to Hip Hop I.E. dick ridng another cats style which is a big no no in Hip Hop. And I'm sick of New York talking that "We gotta bring Hip Hop back to the east coast" shit. I never thought it left IMO, and yes the quality of music is "dumbed down" but at the same time you gotta ask the question "how did it become dumbed down"? And "will I consider as a consumer and Hip Hopper to contribute to dumbing it down"? The south, west, east nor north has nothing to do with dumbing Hip Hop down its people that perfer to hear and buy material that places Hip Hop music in a downward spiral to become dumbed down.

 

[LDB]

if you really wanna look at it in a simple way or if anyone wants to place the blame, than balme yourself or better yet the consumer who buys Hip Hop records cause if anyone of us go to a record store and really look for "Real Hip Hop" records you will find that "Real Hip Hop" artist and great music (not including backpack artist i.e. asop rock to pack fm) still does exist. People just choose to go for what alot of us consider bullshit music. the problem is not with the south like I and many have said before cause if you look at New York, Jerz and Philly, alot of those cats are running with the south's style or "swagger" when it comes to Hip Hop I.E. dick ridng another cats style which is a big no no in Hip Hop. And I'm sick of New York talking that "We gotta bring Hip Hop back to the east coast" shit. I never thought it left IMO, and yes the quality of music is "dumbed down" but at the same time you gotta ask the question "how did it become dumbed down"? And "will I consider as a consumer and Hip Hopper to contribute to dumbing it down"? The south, west, east nor north has nothing to do with dumbing Hip Hop down its people that perfer to hear and buy material that places Hip Hop music in a downward spiral to become dumbed down.

Amen....dudes need to stop looking for an easy scape goat!

 

[ManDAmyth]

I blame Akon... Not because I don't like his music, well because I blame for everything since that "put the blame on me" song he put out....lol...

LMBAOROF. Yes it was that good.

In reference to your comment though, I still can't blame the consumers. I still think the onus is on the artist because the determine the diversity.

Consumers can wish all day for diversity in music, but that can only be created by artists.

I love real hip hop. Yet I also love to throw on Nelly or Big Tymers every once in awhile to dance around the house with my daughter and wife.

Everything has it's place, and diversity is key. If there was more diversity in the music none of us would bother to complain about all the wack stuff.

Also, I don't think any of us really blame the south for the state of affairs.

But when your the king of the mountain there comes responsibility. The south is in a position to showcase real hip hop in the most diverse way possible and it has not.

If Buttecrack, MT was on top of the game right now we'd be saying the same thing about them.

 

[2GooD Productions]

The whole way music is marketed these days has a major influence on hiphops downfall, yes I agree people are generally stupid and easily led, our governments make that very easy to see as does the media, which is only fed to us because its popular. Drugs sex & violence sells its controversial, thats always been the case. PE, Cypress Hill, NWA, Getto Boys, Ice T the list could go on and on. Some of the biggest selling rap songs of all time have been controversial, and the contoversy makes it talked about which then sells copies. Yes the consumers are to blame but only for beleiving what they are being told. Nowadays we are told a song is a hit before it even goes on sale, the gullible "general public" beleives the hype and makes it a self fulfilling prophecy in a way. Marketing of any kind is basically thought manipulation, and trying to make the product as appealling as possible to the consumer.
Labels put a lot of money into a major artist and thats a lot of money that needs to be recouped in sales, otherwise they could lose a hell of a lot of money. Im talking millions of dollars on pushing just one album.
As for people dumping on the south, and blaming it for the problems.
Timbaland is one of the greatest producers to ever make hiphop music, he alone totally reshaped the sound we call hiphop, from the days of Aaliyah, Ginuwine, Magoo, Missy that was way back in 93/94. And hes from the south, which I obviously dont need to point out, he may have recently gone pop but he still deserves a lot of credit for what he has acheived. But LDB you say that there is a lot of good music in the south, but other people who are not from the south dont know whats going on there if they never get to hear it. So they make a judgement based on what they do know, and thats what is fed to them by the radio stations and music videos stations.
We can only make judgements based on what we know. And for that I can only blame the execs at the stations for doing what their bosses want based on whats discussed at things like bilderberg meetings, and the planned and implemented dumbing down of society over the last 20 or so years. A stupid society is easy to control, its a fact, its a known fact and because its known thats why its used against us. Govern ment, simply means control.
And if you want to release any song (legally) ever, at the top of the tree for clearing its release is the government. At least thats how it works here in the uk. At the same time I do blame the closed minded general public, concentrating on having to pay bills and work ever longer working hours have let their defences slip. But we are up against experts of manipulation, who do you blame?