Trayvon Martin

[StressWon]

Zimmerman was a psychopath. He has the classic signs. It just happened to be a black kid. I think if it was a Spanish kid or a white kid, or a purple,,etc,,dude wanted to mirk somebody awfully bad.

 

[UNORTHODOX]

i think where everybody is going wrong is by making it a race issue. if we took race out of it, and looked at it for what it was (an unstable dude with a gun, murdering an unarmed kid) they would have a lot better chance at a conviction. you can't really prove racism in a court of law, so just leave it out all together. argue the facts that are there.

Racial profiling CANNOT be ignored. Its a behavior that needs to be addressed in this country and to say it isnt a race issue, when Zimmerman has shown (on record) a fear of black men is ridiculous. Argue the facts but dont let him skate off without challenging his racially based habits/fears.

Here's where the doubt lays... He did follow the kid after he ran. That's what we do know.


Now from the time he hung up the phone, to the time he was shot is what is in question. An eyewitness says that zimmerman was laying on the ground and the "child" was beating his ass. Ok. Now...Zim's story states that since he couldn't find the kid, he went back to his car and was attacked from behind. Now if that's what happened....Stand your ground is in Zimmerman's favor...that minute or two after the 911 call is the problem here...they can discredit the dude all they want......the defense will do the same about Trayvon, who was in Sanford because a 10 day school suspension. Now there are also reports (not sure if these reports are true) of him being caught with drugs in his bag and a ton of women's jewelry, also got into trouble for vandalism)... Now if these are all true...the defense will use that to say that Trayvon was a gangsta wannabe.... I mean shit...they'll attack his twitter name "No_Limit_Nigga"....And how days before he was killed, his friend tweets him about Trayvon "swinging on the bus driver" This case is going to have a lot of mudslinging.....

At the end, from what was presented.....there's just too much doubt.

1) The governer already said stand your ground doesnt apply here,2) he was the aggressor AND 3) how does Trayvon's personality make doubt? None of this deals with the case directly, at most its circumstancial but doesnt trump what is on the calls and on record.

I,m sorry I always thought that a 911 operator was an officer of the law.
And in the cases where operators are not sworn officers they represent the police.
Being a criminal justice student, zimm should have known not to follow trayvon(....) Trayvon was wandering aimlessly? Thats what teenagers do, I do that when I'm on the phone, in fact, I don't know too many people that don't move around aimlessly while on the phone(...) Even if the operator was just an operator that person was in a higher position of authority as a rep of the agency, than zimmerman and had he stayed his ass in his car tray would still be alive....

Naw, the operators arent authorities. But Zimmermans father is a Judge Magistrate. He bailed him out of a bunch of violence issues (And almost got him out of this until social media/demand got the FBI involved), he should know what behavior is acceptable and isnt. His connections is probably why he felt he'd get away with it.

Trayvon was coming from the store, headed to his moms house, never heard the wandering aimlessly from anywhere pro or anti trayvon

If I walk outside tonight & kill someone who I deemed suspicious after being told not to follow them by a 911 operator there is a 99.99999999% chance that I'll be arrested tonight moments after the cops arrive on the seen. What makes this Zimmerman guy so different than me? This is Racial! If someone believes that its not they are probably too privileged to see past they're utopian lifestyle, or just blind to the reality that racism has never stopped existing, never slowed down, and has always been used as a major component in the division of different races for a myriad of reasons. I don't know what happened the night Trayvon was murdered but I do know of 2 people who do, One is dead, and the other took the logically flawed humanistic approach of saying I feared for my life. Had yo bitch ass not followed that kid you may have never had anything to fear that night. Fear sometimes is worse than courage, because at least doing something courageous is "sometimes" done with the intent of standing in front of what you've done. Fear on the other hand is something you can "sometimes" hide behind when your actions didn't have the best possible outcome. #fuckzimmermansbitchmurderinass!!!! The thoughts, views, & opinions expressed here are those of Nobody Else. You don't have to like them, just remember that you have the right to freely express your own.

Agreed. If your family had judge level connections, in a town where police are proven to be racial biased you'd have a chance of getting away though.

I agree with your thoughts they are my own, but in the interest of handling this issue I think we can do major damage to the problem even without involving race.
Is it racial? What isn't?
Especially when so many opinions are involved...
The point is we need to focus on real goals.
One if the police say stand your ground is the reason he was not arrested, maybe we need to examine that law.

Racially equality and racial respect ISNT a real goal??

The police in that town are sloppy when its a race issue, and stand your ground is an excuse for them to do whatever the fuck they want. Get rid of the law but it doesnt change the behavior, race is the REAL goal here.

 

[drex]

Of course they're goals but what we're missing in all of this energetic motion is focus.
We need something we can all or at least most of us, get behind and push thru to it's finish while everybody os still on fire.
Namean? If we just all stay pissed arguing minutiae and gossip, pointing fingers without being able to enforce consequences, we will waste serious momentum.
Momentum is expensive.
This time it cost a life, I just want something to change on a wide scale, bot just an arrest not just a conviction, but serious social awareness that motivates intelligent action. I wanna see something good come of this, media shit storm and the loss Trayvon and his family suffered. Feel me? Thats what I mean by focus. And I feelthat racial equality is impossible by definition so that should actuall be exchanged for ethnic anonymity or something... Race is pretty much artificial.

 

[LP*]

I believe that the media does use racial issues to keep people divided, however I do believe that this case was racially motivated. I personally don't think that the stand your ground law even applies here, he followed Trayvon when he had no business doing so, even if Trayvon and him got in a fight Zimmerman was the one who started it. That's like if you start a fight and then start to lose does that give you the right to shoot that person? Especially if that person is unarmed? Zimmerman was not standing his ground he was pursuing Trayvon when he had no business to do so. He should have been arrested, and that's the responding officers fault that he wasn't. Now say if a black man would have shot a 17 year old white kid, or a black man would have shot another young black man.Do you still think that person would have got off with the stand your ground excuse? I don't. All the family was asking for was an arrest, the fact that it took this long for Zimmerman to be arrested is crazy. If he is not found guilty he will probly be dealt with, if he is found guilty he will probly get dealt with in prison. A kid was murdered for no good reason, and that's terrible. I guess we will just have to see how it plays out.

 

[UNORTHODOX]

Of course they're goals but what we're missing in all of this energetic motion is focus.
We need something we can all or at least most of us, get behind and push thru to it's finish while everybody os still on fire.
Namean? If we just all stay pissed arguing minutiae and gossip, pointing fingers without being able to enforce consequences, we will waste serious momentum.
Momentum is expensive.
This time it cost a life, I just want something to change on a wide scale, bot just an arrest not just a conviction, but serious social awareness that motivates intelligent action. I wanna see something good come of this, media shit storm and the loss Trayvon and his family suffered. Feel me? Thats what I mean by focus. And I feelthat racial equality is impossible by definition so that should actuall be exchanged for ethnic anonymity or something... Race is pretty much artificial.

Race cant be ignored, it holds people' heritages, cultures and history etc. What we need is a new education, a sort of forced bias-ing on children to teach them that all these differences are really superficial and not to be feared or judge upon. What needs to be focused on now, is a redefining of stand your ground so that it cant be gamed and abused in situations like these. We need legislation that allows more accountability for police enforcement by civilians.

Teaching differences: Something like this but in more ways

http://craftinclassiks.com/2011/shake-up-your-story/

 

[drex]

Whe I say race shouldn't exist I literally mean the word and the loose notions that follow it.
We need to replace the word race with ethnicity, and all the things you mentioned will follow.
Bias will probably always exist, but I think the quickest way to make the biggest dent in the problem of racism is to end the idea that somehow a Russian and a canadian have more in common than a Libyan and an Italian.
Its 2012, can't we find a better way to classify people than by skin color?
Namean?


Region

 

[UNORTHODOX]

Whe I say race shouldn't exist I literally mean the word and the loose notions that follow it.
We need to replace the word race with ethnicity, and all the things you mentioned will follow.
Bias will probably always exist, but I think the quickest way to make the biggest dent in the problem of racism is to end the idea that somehow a Russian and a canadian have more in common than a Libyan and an Italian.
Its 2012, can't we find a better way to classify people than by skin color?
Namean?


Region

Yea I get you but, skin color is only an excuse to divide. If we were all one color, the hate would be region. Its a behavior/perspective issue. Region is better, but I fear the energy of hate of skin would just transfer. We need to attack the behavior not the symptoms, by dispelling fears and quelling irrationalities.

 

[drex]

Agreed.
Now how?

 

[UNORTHODOX]

Thats the dilemma, become a teacher or lawmaker and influence/serve these needs

 

[drex]

Or a rapper!

 

[Sucio]

911 dispatchers are civilian employees. Like a customer service agent...

yes, they are you link to the cops.....not THE cops...they do not have lawful authority, they are trained to handle situations, however there is a reason why they did not verbalize to STOP following the kid...."you don't have to do that" is about as far as they could go....make recommendations based on their training, but we are of no obligation to adhere to their direction..


The governor said that stand your ground doesn't apply here....big deal...he's a politician...and if you know anything about Rick Scott, he's not the best suited for the job here, either. (He resigned as Chief Executive of Columbia/HCA in 1997 amid a controversy over the company's business and Medicare billing practices; the company ultimately admitted to fourteen felonies and agreed to pay the federal government over $600 million; What they were doing was double and tripling medicare costs to the government.... So one visit would result in charging the government more than once for the visit......yeah they paid it back...he was Chief Executive...he wasn't implicated, but come on...let's be realistic here.)

Rick Scott will do that to get the minority vote, because he's a republican.... It's a political move.....

...and only voted in because Alex Sink was not governor material. ......

It's up to the state to prove that it doesn't apply....beyond a reasonable doubt. There's a gray area from what happened after the 911 call and when the kid was shot....

Two plausible versions....that's not enough for me.

 

[UNORTHODOX]

My fault, it was Jeb Bush (I know), and this quote is from the lawmakers that made the law.
(former Sen. Durell Peaden and current state Rep. Dennis Baxley):

The 911 tapes strongly suggest Zimmerman overstepped his bounds, they say, when the Sanford neighborhood crime-watch captain said he was following Trayvon and appeared to ignore a police request to stay away.

“The guy lost his defense right then,” said Peaden. “When he said ‘I’m following him,’ he lost his defense.”

http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/03/20/2703579/state-senator-calls-for-hearings.html

Apparently, zimmermans own attorney also stated that stand your ground doesnt apply here:

"In my legal opinion, that's not really applicable to this case. The statute on 'stand your ground' is primarily when you're in your house," said Craig Sonner, Zimmerman's attorney.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/24/justice/florida-teen-shooting/index.html

and proving "beyond reasonable doubt" is only works in fair trials. We both know how America is, lets be reasonable.

 

[dacalion]

Am I missing something here? Does it really matter if the dispatcher is a civilian? To me, they still can be used as a witness and the 911 tapes as evidence...no?

 

[drex]

Idk, I wouldassume theirrecordings are at least as good as surveillance video...
And I've seen websites that list 911 operators as officers. i'll do more research into this.

 

[Sucio]

I think where the issue lies is what happened after the 911 call...Yes he followed him as he verbalized it...and he ignored the request from the 911 dispatcher....However, if the defense can prove that he was walking back to his car and was attacked from behind (which is Zimmerman's story), stand your ground applies...

Mark O'Mara is Zimmerman's laywer...hired yesterday... These lawyers whom you refer to are no longer his counsel, and would state their own opinion as such...and I'm sure it's a pretty biased opinion. Zimmerman stopped speaking with them for one reason or another...and of course make a huge news conference about not representing him, anymore.....Not to mention at the same time questioning the man's mindstate, which is about as unethical as it gets....



Dox..it's Casey Anthony all over again...many questions...few answers.

 

[Ozmosis]

Martin is dead, Zimmerman can say whatever he wants. He can say Martin had some sort of weapon as well, Who's going to say he not telling the truth?

 

[UNORTHODOX]

Sucio, did you look at the dates? they were still his lawyer. Even worse

Agreed Ozmosis

 

[dacalion]

His first lawers dropped him yesterday, according to them he was NOT keeping in touch with them.

 

[Relic]

Sucio I think you are missing the point here...
And that point is , I am always right and your opinon is to be shunned and invalidated and then branded as wrong just wholesale.
Thats the real issue in this country right now.

Thank you , and Kill the dolphins.