Since I have been in Audio school

[PKProductions]

Well, I finally made the decision to go to Audio engineering and recording school and I am very glad I did. The best thing about it is being able to go into the studio basically whenever I want, and get on professional grade equipment, but its set up so you can only get on the gear they have taught you, so as the course goes on more and more things become unlocked. Also get this they gave me a mac book, Pro Tools, and Logic Pro, which is basically everything ill need (and Mac is also growing on me). But I am going to SAE (School of Audio Engineering) at the Atlanta campus, its fucking ill. There is so much stuff that it seems like I never could have learned if I didnt come here, so glad I did.

Yes I am learning Analog and Digital

Here is a small list of boards and gear we have here

Yamaha 02R studio
Mackie 8Bus Studio
Solid State Logic 4000 studio
Neve studio but I dont know the specifics on which board it is
Midi Studios equiped with Reason, Ableton Live, Cubase, Pro Tools, Peak, Logic Pro, Melodyne. Axiom 61 key keyboard in each.

Also I have to learn all those programs as well before I graduate, and pick between Pro Tools and Logic to get certified on and between Reason, Ableton, and Cubase for my second certification.

Everyone told me not to go this route, but I did anyway on a hunch, and it has majorly paid off. Not to mention my teachers here have platinum plaque after platinum plaque and most of them are hanging on the wall in the school, and they are big artists too like Beyonce, Ludacris, P Diddy, Shakira, Lil Kim, Missy Elliot, and my teacher has told story after story about all kinds of people he has worked with, its crazy. Anyway, im having a blast here, not sure if this is the right place to post this, but things have been looking up lately.

 

[Shonsteez]

The 02R seems to be everywhere! lol....
We put ours in the shool graveyard after the University finally copped that new Mackie X-Buss a couple semesters back when I was going to school.
The 02Rs still a workhorse though.

As for certification:
Even though I advocate Logic over PT any day as a personal preference, once you get out into the workforce you'll find that PT is still the dominant DAW being used everywhere so if I were you Id opt to get certified in PT instead of Logic so that your more qualified for the majority of audio related jobs out there just as heads up.

 

[7thangel]

pt certification is a waste of money (and if done right, a continual drain on cash). unless an employer specifically requires certification (rare), it's not needed.

 

[Shonsteez]

He's already paying to go to SAE, its part of his curriculum.

I think with the given choices of other DAWs to become certified in as he wrote above, thats the most logical choice.

I know a handful of classmates who chose to get PT certified instead of whatever the PT counterparts were and that certification just shows the employer that you know your way around PT more then anything else. Its not that they actually require a candidate with certification although that may occur on rare occasions....

This is just in regards to PK's original post, not my personal prefs on DAWs, etc.

 

[7thangel]

no worries, i was just making a general statement

 

[Relic]

I gotta say, Im jealous..lol.
Dont listen to people who tell you to not goto these schools, true you may end up CEO of a bank instead , but you have to have paper in something to tell Joe Hire ME that you have been to school for something.
Like lawyers tell people not to go to law school, other music people will tell you not to go to school for it because it reduces competition.
If anyone had informed me in highscholl that I could go to school for something like this, I would have done it and not be at this job today.

 

[mono]

I gotta say, Im jealous..lol.

If anyone had informed me in highscholl that I could go to school for something like this, I would have done it and not be at this job today.

yea sure but SAE is not for free. so you either have to take a credit and pay it back from an average audio engineers income l8er on, or your parents have the money

i doubt there is scholarship on sae, is there

 

[Quality]

Yo PKProductions, glad everything is going good for you at school. I appreciate you posting this thread, cause I'm starting an audio school next month on 9/29 and I've had some doubts about things recently. But knowing that things can work out if you put in the work and extra effort is definitely good to know.

Thanks bro.

 

[LDB]

I have an Associates Degree in Music and Entertainment Management.

Though "at the time" I was glad to be in School. I can certifiably say that it was indeed a waste of time and money. A hell of a lot of money at that!!!!

To be honest.....it all depends on what you're trying to do in music. If you plan on having your own business i.e building and running a studio, you'll soon see how much time and money you've wasted!

From personal experience I would say if you're planning on working for someone in the music business you get waaayyyy more experience interning and learning that way. I know teenage kids that posted up in studios that can run laps around anybody in school or anyone that has graduated from a school of this sort.

I know a few dudes that work in the top studios in Atlanta, non of which has spent one day at any school.

Towards the end of my time in school I interned at La Face and Organized Noize. I was surrounded by a bunch of kids and older people that hadn't spent one day in school who ran shit. It was depressing! I spent two years in school and was still expected to intern at these places indefinitely! Running errands, getting burgers and shit.

It will be very hard to get a job doing exactly what you went to school for......most of my classmates who went to school in hopes of landing a job as opposed to starting there own business got jobs in promotion for labels and broadcast television in the form of doing sound set ups at sporting events. All that fancy equipment that they climbed all over in school was no where to be found. They ended up having to learn diff't equipment that ran totally different things. The knowledge of knowing the "signal chain" is the about the only thing that applies to what they now do.

This is not to discourage anybody from going to school! It's just to let you know not to keep those rose colored glasses on once you graduate! That job assistance program those schools have will have you settling for some bullshit just to get your feet wet.

p.s. I definitely wouldn't go to school and spend that kind of money when you're ultimate goal is to produce music or run a small studio. That kid that just cop'd a bootleg copy of, Reason, Abelton Live or FL studio will be years ahead of you in the game once you graduate.

I know many here on ILL can testify to this fact!

 

[Relic]

So how does one intern without a school backing you?

 

[Fury]

I have an Associates Degree in Music and Entertainment Management.

Though "at the time" I was glad to be in School. I can certifiably say that it was indeed a waste of time and money. A hell of a lot of money at that!!!!

To be honest.....it all depends on what you're trying to do in music. If you plan on having your own business i.e building and running a studio, you'll soon see how much time and money you've wasted!

From personal experience I would say if you're planning on working for someone in the music business you get waaayyyy more experience interning and learning that way. I know teenage kids that posted up in studios that can run laps around anybody in school or anyone that has graduated from a school of this sort.

I know a few dudes that work in the top studios in Atlanta, non of which has spent one day at any school.

Towards the end of my time in school I interned at La Face and Organized Noize. I was surrounded by a bunch of kids and older people that hadn't spent one day in school who ran shit. It was depressing! I spent two years in school and was still expected to intern at these places indefinitely! Running errands, getting burgers and shit.

It will be very hard to get a job doing exactly what you went to school for......most of my classmates who went to school in hopes of landing a job as opposed to starting there own business got jobs in promotion for labels and broadcast television in the form of doing sound set ups at sporting events. All that fancy equipment that they climbed all over in school was no where to be found. They ended up having to learn diff't equipment that ran totally different things. The knowledge of knowing the "signal chain" is the about the only thing that applies to what they now do.

This is not to discourage anybody from going to school! It's just to let you know not to keep those rose colored glasses on once you graduate! That job assistance program those schools have will have you settling for some bullshit just to get your feet wet.

p.s. I definitely wouldn't go to school and spend that kind of money when you're ultimate goal is to produce music or run a small studio. That kid that just cop'd a bootleg copy of, Reason, Abelton Live or FL studio will be years ahead of you in the game once you graduate.

I know many here on ILL can testify to this fact!

i knoe it wuz a waste of money and time

 

[LDB]

So how does one intern without a school backing you?

The school doesn't and didn't back me. They told me I could get some credit for doing it but I was on my own as far as securing the internship. I just hit the streets of Atlanta and filled out the intern applications around the city. It wasn't mandatory but I wanted to see how the big boyz did things. Actually one of the guys that was in my class who was a relative of the office manager at Organized got me the internship. He was a dumb as and cheated of me a lot, I was 25 and he was fresh out of high school and stuck on stupid! I sat around and answered phones all day, went on food and errand runs and on occasion drop'd shit off at the Dungeon (Organized Noize). They already had there people in place and most were relatives or friends or relatives or other people with connects already in the industry. Outsiders could only get so far and so close!

 

[Kontents]

^^^
What school did you go to?

When you did your internship was it required that you were in school to be there? or could you just intern without being enrolled?

 

[Relic]

This is getting interesting .
Without classes and the experience how does one develop the business knowledge to go forth and attain more knowledge and skills?
Certainly as much shit as you know about gear you didnt "just get it" without manuals and shit by plugging it up and playing? I mean the classes at least give you a sense of how shit works (although I dont need to study the nature of a soundwave to know how to engineer).

 

[mercurywaters]

i think what ldb is saying is that the education is valuable but not worth paying for. i feel the same way about culinary school. i wasted 20 grand and a year of my life and learned a bunch of stuff i've never used in my 13 years in the restaurant industry. and the stuff i can use, i could have learned on the job for free. i think for certain jobs its better to just get your foot in the door and learn. humble yourself and work for free. nobody will refuse free help. if you show a desire to learn, they'll teach you. especially since a lot of recording is software based now, its a lot cheaper to pay for software and learn it yourself than to go to school. there's local studios all over the place. get in there and learn for free.

 

[LDB]

This is getting interesting .
Without classes and the experience how does one develop the business knowledge to go forth and attain more knowledge and skills?
Certainly as much shit as you know about gear you didnt "just get it" without manuals and shit by plugging it up and playing? I mean the classes at least give you a sense of how shit works (although I dont need to study the nature of a soundwave to know how to engineer).

In all honesty Relic, "right hand to the sky". Everything I know I got on my own experimenting with gear over the years and getting with people who were already doing what I wanted to do and just observing. If you want to know something bad enough you will get it, even if it takes reading a manual from front to back.

I can see where going to school would really come into play if you one day wanted to be an instructor. That's where knowing all the technical terms and being able to relay them to a student would work to your benefit. The truth of the matter is that very few students going to school are doing it for that reason. Most just want to make music and record music. If took a poll when I was in school that would've have been 98% of my classmates. Most just wanted to do music.

Going to school being the most effective way to get it just isn't true. If I had it to do all over again I would've went to business school and got some music theory somewhere. They try to cram a lot of information into those two years. Nothing is broad. I didn't get the "meat" until I got out there on my own. Real talk!

P.s I went to the Atlanta Art Institute for Music and Entertainment Management and I also took a course in video production ( I actually wish I had taken the full course in that ), and no Kontents, being in school was not a requirement but it did help me get in faster. Everybody wants to help out those that are in school, you could lie and say you're in school, it's not like they check.

The bottom line for me is that I could have got everything they taught me on my own had I done some digging by way of the internet etc. In my opinion those schools are too damn expensive for what you get in return. There are not enough jobs out there for recording engineers. Most good engineers are not locked down to one studio. Big time artist deal with a hand full of engineers that have been around forever. Why? Because of the knowledge that they have from years of working in the business. Not because they went to school for it. The best engineers don't go by the book. Through trial and error they've developed there own way of mixing/recording and that's what they're sought after for. The knowledge of having done it! Someone who only knows the books side of things will never get called on to mix & record a Michael Jackson album!

Once again, I'm not telling people not to go to school. Just know what your ultimate goal is and what steps you need to take to get there. School may not be it! Taking that 20 grand a year and investing in gear may be a more plausible route. Would have been for me!

 

[mono]

sae is not for becomming a raproducer, or better songwriter. but when youre making music anyway, why not do it. cant be bad to know about oscillattors, accoustics and wiring plus you get a recognized receipt and you get work around the globe as an engineer

 

[7thangel]

a little advice if you're going to school, try to get an internship while you're still going to school and don't wait to when you're done or even near done.

if interning, make sure there's an end date, or you'll be interning forever. once that time is up and they don't make a commitment to you, find another place to either work or intern (that means keeping internships at a reasonable time period)

try to expand into live sound, officially, you'll be on the low totem pole for a good while, wrapping cables and hard labour, but eventually you'll get a shot or go another route and become a band, or better yet, a hip hop artists, live sound person. (if you stress to them the importance of early sound checks, maybe they'll stop with the constant 'yo soundman, turn me up')

the most important thing school can give you, is contacts, both established contacts and your peers. don't sleep on 'em

 

[LDB]

sae is not for becomming a raproducer, or better songwriter. but when youre making music anyway, why not do it. cant be bad to know about oscillattors, accoustics and wiring plus you get a recognized receipt and you get work around the globe as an engineer

True but some think it's a way in. If I'm not mistaking when Pk first joined the site he was asking about various equipment from a "wanting to produce perspective". Go back and read some of his first posts.

As far as oscillators, acoustics etc You don't have to get in debt by way of student loans to learn that. The fact of the matter is that only 1 in a hundred...if that, actually squeak thru. Most either do other things in the business or go to work doing everyday things instead or lose interest. Sooner or later you have to pay your bills. Can't keep wishing on a star!

 

[savage_g]

Qualifications in this industry are completely worthless - not pointless, but not useful to getting any kind of related job.
Putting it simply, when I did sound engineering at college EVERY tutor I had, had aspirations of being a big name artist or producer in the industry. And all of them them were working at a college on a shitty ass wage.

Cosign with lil drama boy - you don't have to go to school to learn about sound engineering; you can teach yourself that now off the net etc. It will be a hobby until u make the contacts u need to get recognised; regardless if you went to college or not.