Yeah i agree, I have spent hours mixing a track before only to hate the final result the next day, when i realise I have over done it and ended up with something worse than what I started with.
Mixing Music
- Thread starter Nocturnl
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Yeah i agree, I have spent hours mixing a track before only to hate the final result the next day, when i realise I have over done it and ended up with something worse than what I started with.
LMAO... yeah rav man you really need to lighten up a bit, you really do need a thick skin for this music shit. Just roll with the punches, you can learn a lot from some of the people on this site, and Sucio is very much one of them.
and what more do you need?
Each thing there has its use, and does the job well, there are better ones but that requires rewiring into protools or some other DAW so you can use third party plugins like waves. But really the ones in reason are adequate enough for the job, I use reason 5, send me a beat in reason format, I will mix it for you, and send it back so you can study what I used and what settings I used.
Oh and just a point, but sometimes compression is like makeup on a woman, "less is more"
Nocturnl
Man Utd Nut
ill o.g.
Battle Points: 1
Will loop up something and send u soon g
I agree that albums and music in general were mixed differently 20 yrs ago, however, I don't agree that MORE compression is the SOLE answer for obtaining that sound. I was listening to a Premo Mix Show recorded 2-18-1994 from WBLS. I couldn't help but noticing how well their compression was setup. Personally, I haven't heard anything close in comparison even on todays standards.
I listen to a lot of music, at home and on the go. When I'm in my SUV (which has a factory Bose System) I listen to my Satellite Radio and CD player about equally. Neither comes close to what WBLS was doing in 1994. Nevertheless, imo, the loudness war was more relevant back then and has gradually fallen off nowadays with the fall of high end home systems that could better handle that type of mixing/compression. We're rocking mp3's now...a format that loses sound quality in the conversion!
The loudness war has been replaced with clarity (which fits right in with the over saturation of mp3 music). So, good sounding music can be achieved without using parallel compression only.
thedreampolice
A backwards poet writes inverse.
Listen to "loose yourself" by eme
hear the guitars pulsing, at the beginning? That all compression and LOTS of it.
Honestly tons of compression is the sound of hip-hop. MOST of the time if the engineer is using the compressor correctly you cant hear it enough to pick it out. But it makes a huge difference. One of my favorite engineers uses 4 different compressors on 4 buses and uses it for tone shaping. I find myself doing similar things in Propellerheads Record, I turn on the SSL compressors and have it hardly touch the signal but it changes the tone enough that it can gel a mix together.
Also to tell you the truth, I beat the shit out of my compressors. Listen to this track
http://soundcloud.com/drunk-pedestrians/ode-to-john
The drums have TONS AND TONS AND TON of compression on them. But that's how I got that huge sound.
hear the guitars pulsing, at the beginning? That all compression and LOTS of it.
Honestly tons of compression is the sound of hip-hop. MOST of the time if the engineer is using the compressor correctly you cant hear it enough to pick it out. But it makes a huge difference. One of my favorite engineers uses 4 different compressors on 4 buses and uses it for tone shaping. I find myself doing similar things in Propellerheads Record, I turn on the SSL compressors and have it hardly touch the signal but it changes the tone enough that it can gel a mix together.
Also to tell you the truth, I beat the shit out of my compressors. Listen to this track
http://soundcloud.com/drunk-pedestrians/ode-to-john
The drums have TONS AND TONS AND TON of compression on them. But that's how I got that huge sound.
i use parallel compression but i only use a splash of it!
headz be abusing the compression! and i was one of them
they are other ways to increase loudness without compression
only thing i have issue's with is my vocals if i can just get them like i can with my beats it will be on!! as for the beats i layer everthing im old school so i dont have to use that much compression to get my soud louder at all
and if u are using reason or record the maximizer is a good tool to use to bring up loudness and also have it not clip exsepcial if u use the 4om wall limiter properply! it creates a wall that allows u to still keep proper head room!
and if u want that dirtyness and less cleaness export it out at a lower khz wit a lower bit ratio these days some thangs r just to clean! i also dont compress the over all track it self cuz when converting to mp3 it gets compress exspecially when i export it as a mp3 at 320kps
headz be abusing the compression! and i was one of them
they are other ways to increase loudness without compression
only thing i have issue's with is my vocals if i can just get them like i can with my beats it will be on!! as for the beats i layer everthing im old school so i dont have to use that much compression to get my soud louder at all
and if u are using reason or record the maximizer is a good tool to use to bring up loudness and also have it not clip exsepcial if u use the 4om wall limiter properply! it creates a wall that allows u to still keep proper head room!
and if u want that dirtyness and less cleaness export it out at a lower khz wit a lower bit ratio these days some thangs r just to clean! i also dont compress the over all track it self cuz when converting to mp3 it gets compress exspecially when i export it as a mp3 at 320kps
thedreampolice
A backwards poet writes inverse.
LMAO, both maximizer's and limiters are compressors. In fact a limiter is a compressor basically on full.
See that guitar doesn't impress me at all and even worse, I've seen Em live and the guitar sounded 10X better - live! which leads me to this conclusion... you like what you like, it's called a personal preference, nothings wrong with that UNTIL you try to make the world around you like everything the way YOU like it. Get rid of the tunnel vision!
I thought the point of using a compressor was to compress the dynamic range of sounds. IE squash the sound then use the gain to bring it back up to where it was before, so the quieter sounds sound louder in the mix without making the louder sounds peak or distort, I know you can also use compression to change the tone of sounds, but to increase volume as a whole, im not so sure, I think eq's and the mixer do a better job of that. And a limiter/maximizer, like you say it is just a compressor on max, that is to get the most volume out of a final mix without peaks. Thats what I use it for anyway. I think using eq's on every channel has a better result than using compression.
I can get my drums to bang and leave headroom for a bassline pretty easily by just using eq's. And only using compression on the overall mixdown.
I can get my drums to bang and leave headroom for a bassline pretty easily by just using eq's. And only using compression on the overall mixdown.
I do some compression to my music....very little....
I focus mainly on the space...
People forget about the making space.....
I've noticed people compressing the shit out of their tracks, but there's NO space for sound.. All their frequency ranges are just too damn crowded...
I learned that from listening to joints from this site....
I have been a fan of Dac's mix.... His tracks give a lot of space for the elements...which make it sound crispy as hell......I think that's more important than anything else.....
I focus mainly on the space...
People forget about the making space.....
I've noticed people compressing the shit out of their tracks, but there's NO space for sound.. All their frequency ranges are just too damn crowded...
I learned that from listening to joints from this site....
I have been a fan of Dac's mix.... His tracks give a lot of space for the elements...which make it sound crispy as hell......I think that's more important than anything else.....
Bitrate compression and audio compression are 2 different things.
exactly!!
thedreampolice
A backwards poet writes inverse.
Why then do they make SSL compressors, Neve compressors, API compressors? They all have drastically different tone!
I also think you guys are missing a bunch of what I am trying to say. Proper use of compression helps you create space.
Yes that is using a compressor wrong, honestly I have only met a handful of people that REALLY use a compressor correctly.
Also that HUGE 808 sound is just as much because of compression is it is the 808.
I think Dac made a great point tho, when he said its all a matter of taste.
Proper use of an eq also creates space, and can eliminate frequency clash.
EDIT: also panning can help eliminate frequency clash.
I think technically a compressor fills space. While an expander makes space. In dynamic range/headroom anyway. I think using compression for other things is more creative use of the compressor by taking advantage of its nuances/side effects, rather than "proper" use. Which as I described is simply compressing the dynamic range hence the name compressor.
I know what you are saying DP, it makes sense, especially in the loudness wars which are very much a digital media thing anyway. I know full well that compression on drums is very effective, especially when sidechained but it is all about taste at the end of the day.
I just need to learn compression more....
Once you've think you've learned how to use it.....you're back to square one...it's crazy....
And all those types of compressors have different algorithms, which of course do different things to a sound...even at the same exact settings.... that's where taste comes in, in terms of the sound you're looking/hearing for.
Once you've think you've learned how to use it.....you're back to square one...it's crazy....
And all those types of compressors have different algorithms, which of course do different things to a sound...even at the same exact settings.... that's where taste comes in, in terms of the sound you're looking/hearing for.
UNORTHODOX
Father Timeless
Every aspect of music is like that for me! I get bored VERY easily but music has so many aspects that change culturally and personally, there is ALWAYS something to learn/discover/experiment with.
I honestly believe that the key lies within how you approach compression and when it's truely needed. Your approach should be determination, tenacity and testing. There are general rules to follow but even they aren't set in gold. For the most part, what we do here on ill doesn't require a lot of compression (if any). We deal with a lot of samples that are already compressed, and there's nothing wrong with adding some light compression to shape your sound. But to go all out on precompressed samples is a waste of time.
Compression really isn't a factor until you start composing and/or doing vocals. You have to rely on your ears. If something is wrong or missing, your ears will tell you even if you don't know anything about compression. For those of us that use FL Studio, compression comes by default. When you open a new project or start a new session, the FL Limiter opens up in the Master Channel on the mixer automatically (unless you turn it off). It's set to stop anything over 0db no matter how loud your sample or instruments are. From that point on, all you have to do is some minor tweaking to get the results that you're looking for.
Compression really isn't a factor until you start composing and/or doing vocals. You have to rely on your ears. If something is wrong or missing, your ears will tell you even if you don't know anything about compression. For those of us that use FL Studio, compression comes by default. When you open a new project or start a new session, the FL Limiter opens up in the Master Channel on the mixer automatically (unless you turn it off). It's set to stop anything over 0db no matter how loud your sample or instruments are. From that point on, all you have to do is some minor tweaking to get the results that you're looking for.
Formant024
Digital Smokerings
ill o.g.
^^^ thats one way to look at it but, use the limiter as temp reference but i suggest always to turn it off to get peak at what your mix is really doing.