Full sail

[God]

DO NOT GO TO FULL SAIL. I REPEAT DO NOT GO TO FULL SAIL.

I talked to an engineer about it-- says he gets so many applicants and the audio engineering industry is consolidating (i.e. contracting/losing jobs.)

Get a 4 year college education. You're better off being a studio rat for some dude, and work your way up. Best to do it in a music center like LA, NYC or Nashville so you can parlay your contacts into the record biz.

Seriously, Full Sail is a waste of time.

ANYBODY SERIOUSLY CONSIDERING FULL SAIL NEEDS TO RECONSIDER. YOU ARE WASTING TIME AND MONEY. L.A. IS FULL OF CATS TRYING TO MAKE IT HOLDING A "FULL SAIL 'I'M A PRO-TOOLS EXPERT'" CERTIFICATE. YOU GOTTA BE ABOVE THE FRAY. FULL-SAIL ISN'T SHIT!!!!!

Engineers respect cats that know shit like electrical engineering or something. CONTACT ME AND I WILL DISSUADE YOU TO WASTE YOUR TIME AND MONEY.

 

[Shonsteez]

Yo appreciate the feedback dude. I know what you mean with industry being straight competitive and a lot of hard work. But I feel its my passion and I'll do whatever it takes to make a living with it. I think that I will probably end up in FS next year, and I know it'll be worth effort and work.

Just wondering, what exactly did you go for (like what school and career). Do you mean that you became an engineer also?

Again props for the feedback.

Sorry man, i havent checked back here for a day or so...

I went to an accredited university for a bachelors in Recording Arts. CSU CHICO to be precise. Mainly due to my lack of funds to go elsewhere, but it just so happens that CSUCHICO is actually one of the top respected universities for teaching the Recording Arts program because they dont just teach you the fundamentals of using PT, etc...

As far as what i do personally I just engineer my own music and music for others locally. I havent moved onto larger things yet. This is my last semester at CSU and then im done, thank god. (No pun intended). And after that well well see. I want to try to get into A/V work but its a very consolidated industry where jobs usually hire within themselves rather than advertise for the spot. But theres numerous positions that i could obtain thats just what i would like to do the most. Sound Design, or ADR recordist would be kinda cool....Im still sortin shit out.

DO NOT GO TO FULL SAIL. I REPEAT DO NOT GO TO FULL SAIL.

I talked to an engineer about it-- says he gets so many applicants and the audio engineering industry is consolidating (i.e. contracting/losing jobs.)

Get a 4 year college education. You're better off being a studio rat for some dude, and work your way up. Best to do it in a music center like LA, NYC or Nashville so you can parlay your contacts into the record biz.

Seriously, Full Sail is a waste of time.

ANYBODY SERIOUSLY CONSIDERING FULL SAIL NEEDS TO RECONSIDER. YOU ARE WASTING TIME AND MONEY. L.A. IS FULL OF CATS TRYING TO MAKE IT HOLDING A "FULL SAIL 'I'M A PRO-TOOLS EXPERT'" CERTIFICATE. YOU GOTTA BE ABOVE THE FRAY. FULL-SAIL ISN'T SHIT!!!!!

Engineers respect cats that know shit like electrical engineering or something. CONTACT ME AND I WILL DISSUADE YOU TO WASTE YOUR TIME AND MONEY.

I hear a lot of the same things from people that worked there. I actually have a couple instructors that switched over from Full Sail to CSU because they respected the university more for its curriculum....This is all biased information mind you. But still its real. I didn't make this shit up. It is what it is i guess.

 

[djswivel]

DO NOT GO TO FULL SAIL. I REPEAT DO NOT GO TO FULL SAIL.

I talked to an engineer about it-- says he gets so many applicants and the audio engineering industry is consolidating (i.e. contracting/losing jobs.)

Get a 4 year college education. You're better off being a studio rat for some dude, and work your way up. Best to do it in a music center like LA, NYC or Nashville so you can parlay your contacts into the record biz.

Seriously, Full Sail is a waste of time.

ANYBODY SERIOUSLY CONSIDERING FULL SAIL NEEDS TO RECONSIDER. YOU ARE WASTING TIME AND MONEY. L.A. IS FULL OF CATS TRYING TO MAKE IT HOLDING A "FULL SAIL 'I'M A PRO-TOOLS EXPERT'" CERTIFICATE. YOU GOTTA BE ABOVE THE FRAY. FULL-SAIL ISN'T SHIT!!!!!

Engineers respect cats that know shit like electrical engineering or something. CONTACT ME AND I WILL DISSUADE YOU TO WASTE YOUR TIME AND MONEY.

Did you go? I am an engineer, so talk to me lol.

I will tell you, if you ever expect to get into a real studio, or working with one of the top engineers, you will have a better shot with an audio engineering degree. Not to say you have to go to Full Sail, quite the contrary. BUT, the majority of people hire out of engineering schools at this point. So unless you have some sort of hook up in the business, the problem is getting your foot in the door.

At the end of the day, hard work pays off more than anything. For me, Full Sail worked out perfectly. Literally I am the success story. For everyone like me, there are 100 that dont make it. Full Sail put me in the position to succeed so I can't agree with your above statements at all. Ppl need to take responsibility for their own lives and MAKE something happen. Even if you go to a regular university, and get a 4 year Bachelors degree, that doesn't mean shit. It doesn't guarantee you a job. It guarantees you a piece of paper and debts. The individual succeeds or fails, not the degree. Understand that.

 

[Shonsteez]

I think both are valid, and it comes down to what u said...You need to make shit happen on your own and not expect your degree to buy you a job. I believe regardless of going to full sail or a 4 yr, its still a total gamble and more of a "be at the right place at the right time" or "know the right people scenario"... As with just about any other opportunity in life really.

I think one major thing to keep in mind considering the main reason your attending any school is to acquire any necessary tools to execute a job, is that typically; a 4 yr. univiersity often lacks funds for particular things like new G5s and Preamps, etc. - Whereas a speciality school like Full Sail donates all of the their time and money directly to maintaing new gear in their studios for their students....Thats one thing i wish i had at my school, which is a serious downfall. But at the same time not entirely a huge pitfall since they still give you the means to employ your skills on a variety of platforms whether it be a tape deck, a digital board, or whatever.....But still, i would have liked to of used newer shit during my academic career. Im sure other 4 yrs have more funding than ours but its pretty common for just about any 4 yr university to have budget cuts and deem things like the music dept to be not as important for whatever idiotic reason.

Just something to consider.

 

[classic]

im gonna jump in

Well ill jump in this debate...

I agree with god... And by agreeing with him i don’t want you to think im knocking your hustle or your decision buy any means swival.. (or anybody else who goes to fullsail) Your doing your thing and you props for that...

But like you said yourself,swival you’re a rare a success story , 1-100 cats get to where your at.
To pay the amount of money you pay to go do full sail and deal with those odds is freaking ridicilous...

I have my bachelor’s degree in computer science from Florida state university
And I have a master’s degree in Information systems/software engineering from The University of Maryland. An audio degree from full sail costs almost as much as my bachelors and masters degree’s …. I’m sorry that’s ridiculous…Especially for an industry where knowledge and experience are the primary yardsticks… For a degree to cost so much with so little earning potential is freaking silly to me.

Now again, swivel.. Im not knocking full sail.. but if you take somebody with my technical background(comp sci, engineering, mathematics) and put them in the studio with a full sail cat.. I guarantee that the engineering cat will be much better off…. And have a much smoother learning curve I don’t care what they teach at fullsail… Once the technology the learned it would be a breeze. (if the person has an ear for music)
As most of us already know audio mixing and mastering is based on ratio’s , algothrems, and frequencies, all stuff that is taught heavily in any technical Bachelor of Science degree.

So when I see cats on this site coming out of high school contemplating going to full sail spending tens of thousands of dollars, thinking that’s going to give them a head start.. Im like NO!!!!

Take your ass to college get a technical degree that means something. Get a degree in a trade like engineering or comp sci and then become an apprentice to somebody in the field. I feel like full sail sales a dream, almost a shortcut to success to a lot of people.

Also if your going to pay that much for a diploma , your skills should transfer to another field. With any technical 4 year degree you have something to fall back on. It seems that with fullsail anytime you move outside your specialized field your fucked.. No safety net what so ever…

Again this is just my opinion and im knocking anybody…Like swival said the main thing is a persons hustle.. but you gotta be smart and play the odds as well

my humble opionion

class..

 

[Shonsteez]

To pay the amount of money you pay to go do full sail and deal with those odds is freaking ridicilous...

It def is a business like anything else. They know they have niche and so they run with it and charge more. Its like fucking pharmaceuticals. The universities are not exempt either but they def charge less in comparison.

Take your ass to college get a technical degree that means something. Get a degree in a trade like engineering or comp sci and then become an apprentice to somebody in the field. I feel like full sail sales a dream, almost a shortcut to success to a lot of people.

As far as music technology in general...If your an industry major and focusing on the business end your most likely going to be assured a job starting at a high wage in a much more immediate fashion vs a Recording Arts major hands down. Theres simply more demand for that kind of work. But unfortunately i dont think it matters if you go to Full Sail or a University if your main focus is the Recording Arts since its still all the same once you graduate and you are out there finding a job. Thats just the way this industry is unfortunately. You have to start at the bottom usually regardless of a degree etc. But it does get u in the door a little further vs not at all. I for one knew this when i started but I honestly cant see myself doing anything else for a living so its just a risk you must take IMO if your really serious about it. I dont regret any of my academic career. Im proud i attended and learned what I did.

My advice is that:
If you do plan to pursue a career in the Recording Arts you should def have a PLAN B. I have a AA in Graphic Design as well which isnt much but ironically that degree has opened up numerous opportunities for me and helped me build a descent portfolio which always gets me a head start. The main thing is to just be real with yourself and try to think of ALL the possible outcomes just in case PLAN A doesnt fall through after all.

But I say pursue your dreams and dont let anybody tell you otherwise. Just be aware of what your getting into.

 

[Ash Holmz]

i see both sides of the coin ... my view on all this is that it depends on your location ... if u already live in a big city .. then ur prolly better off being an intern or coffee grabber and working your way up. But if you live out in east bumblefuck, with no studios or places to get experience, ur def better off going to school because u can learn the game and also develop some relationships and network. Whatver u do just realize that engineering is no joke. The hours, especially on the come up as an assistant, are fucked up. If u like having free time to yourself, look elsewhere.


in general, whatver you do... make sure its YOUR decision .. never take advice from somebody who is in the same boat as you or not in a position that you want to be. And i dont think engineering is a dead field at all. Skills can still get u paid.. alot of cats might have the knowledge/degree but they dont have the ear or the drive. the latter two things are whats gonna get u paid. Theres cats that can talk circles around me concerning gear, mixing, what frequencies to eq or whatever but i listen to their songs they sound like hot crispy polished dogshit. the result is the only thing that matters. If u have the ability to consistently make commercial-quality sounding mixes, u wont be broke. some people just dont have it. and some people dont want to put the effort required to get to where they can do that. the good news is alot of these cats are pretty accessible. when shopping for engineers for the smash project i got personal callbacks from some pretty big name guys... they were out of my league price-wise but i chatted it up with them and they were all mad cool.

 

[thedreampolice]

"For a degree to cost so much with so little earning potential is freaking silly to me."

yup

 

[Shonsteez]

Like i said, it is what it is.

 

[Ash Holmz]

But I say pursue your dreams and dont let anybody tell you otherwise. Just be aware of what your getting into.

basically

 

[N.Y.S.O.M.]

shyt certain studios don't wanna pay u the amount an engineer should be paid I hear puff doesn't pay a lot I had a best friend he quit cuz the pay wasn't right n he spent 3 to 4 days straight in the studio lol

damn but not to discourage u family just prepare urself

 

[Beatz 101]

I was considering going to Full Sail after I got my Bachelors in Graphic Communications Systems. But that joint is:

1.) TOO DAMN EXPENSIVE. And i heard no word of any job placements after graduation.

2.) The Music Industry is fuck'd UP.!


I say get a degree or some certification thats guaranteed bread in your wallet, but won't kill your ambitions as a musician/engineer. While in school and especially between semesters, teach yourself sound engineering basic and beyond. Network with all the dorm room rappers and get some recording experience and connects. Join the college radio station and get experience behind the boards. Intern for a local studio, and learn how that particular business works behind the scenes. And when you graduate, think again on whether you need to drop madd stacks on piece of paper thats not gonna necessarily get you where you need to be.

Cuz to be perfectly honest, i think the music industry(but hiphop FIRST) is gonna go back to the underground for alil bit. And when its goes down, kats aint gonna care where u got ur degree from, they wanna hear some hot mixes. bottomline

I think the best you can do right now is be the BEST at what you do, and NETWORK. That degree dont mean shit. But thats just my opinion, follow your gut/heart.


101

 

[thedreampolice]

Studios are going under by the day. Its cheaper and cheaper to record. Technology is not going away. Big studios are dead.

 

[N.Y.S.O.M.]

Studios are going under by the day. Its cheaper and cheaper to record. Technology is not going away. Big studios are dead.

ur right Dream u can record n mix at the crib now a days or go mobile wit a laptop n audio interface studios will be obsolete soon but not to discourage u again family

but u can do otha things in the studio like mixing when it comes to Movie Scores, Video Games , etc use that degree for all types of music

 

[classic]

studios may be dying but the actual art and skill required to make a good mix are still alive and well.. there will always be a demand for that skill

 

[Chrono]

I say get a degree or some certification thats guaranteed bread in your wallet, but won't kill your ambitions as a musician/engineer. While in school and especially between semesters, teach yourself sound engineering basic and beyond. 101

I agree! I think it is wise to choose a career that is of great interest to you, I chose science. I am going to school and actually just landed a job that is specifically related to the degree I am working for! I have never been more into my own productions and do not look at music at a career whatsoever. Although, in the future I might make extra cash by selling beats.. who knows where music will take you.. although by having a career unrelated to music you are securing yourself and your family! Then if something does break musically for you then it's a bonus.

 

[God]

I'll save you time and money - read what professional, working engineers with years and years of experience have to say about Full Sail:

Link to engineers' discussion about Full Sail (it is very LONG):
http://www.gearslutz.com/board/so-much-gear-so-little-time/136887-going-full-sail-need-advice.html

They don't have a lot of good things to say. Don't believe me? Believe THEM.

No, I didn't go to Full Sail. Get a four year degree at a state university, which is cheaper than out of state tuition.

I see cats from Full-Sail and other engineering schools working at Taco Bell-- the whole music industry is contracting. Even big shots like radio promoters are hurting, and radio promoters used to bring in the heavy money.

Read the Gearslutz post, then think this through.

 

[djswivel]

Well ill jump in this debate...

I agree with god... And by agreeing with him i don’t want you to think im knocking your hustle or your decision buy any means swival.. (or anybody else who goes to fullsail) Your doing your thing and you props for that...

But like you said yourself,swival you’re a rare a success story , 1-100 cats get to where your at.
To pay the amount of money you pay to go do full sail and deal with those odds is freaking ridicilous...

I have my bachelor’s degree in computer science from Florida state university
And I have a master’s degree in Information systems/software engineering from The University of Maryland. An audio degree from full sail costs almost as much as my bachelors and masters degree’s …. I’m sorry that’s ridiculous…Especially for an industry where knowledge and experience are the primary yardsticks… For a degree to cost so much with so little earning potential is freaking silly to me.

Now again, swivel.. Im not knocking full sail.. but if you take somebody with my technical background(comp sci, engineering, mathematics) and put them in the studio with a full sail cat.. I guarantee that the engineering cat will be much better off…. And have a much smoother learning curve I don’t care what they teach at fullsail… Once the technology the learned it would be a breeze. (if the person has an ear for music)
As most of us already know audio mixing and mastering is based on ratio’s , algothrems, and frequencies, all stuff that is taught heavily in any technical Bachelor of Science degree.

So when I see cats on this site coming out of high school contemplating going to full sail spending tens of thousands of dollars, thinking that’s going to give them a head start.. Im like NO!!!!

Take your ass to college get a technical degree that means something. Get a degree in a trade like engineering or comp sci and then become an apprentice to somebody in the field. I feel like full sail sales a dream, almost a shortcut to success to a lot of people.

Also if your going to pay that much for a diploma , your skills should transfer to another field. With any technical 4 year degree you have something to fall back on. It seems that with fullsail anytime you move outside your specialized field your fucked.. No safety net what so ever…

Again this is just my opinion and im knocking anybody…Like swival said the main thing is a persons hustle.. but you gotta be smart and play the odds as well

my humble opionion

class..

I can definitely see your viewpoint, and it makes sense to many ppl. But for me, I didnt want a fall back plan. Music was my only option, because its the only thing I want to wake up every morning doing. So my personal happiness outweighed the risks. But having said that, I still have bills to pay like everyone else, so I HAD to succeed. Failure was not an option. So I worked 100 hour weeks in the studio to make it work

My only disagreement is, you're comparing Full Sail to a state school. You need to compare apples with apples, not oranges. That's not really the correct comparison. As far as audio schools go, Full Sail is the best. So in that specific field, you need to compare its tuition with other elite schools in their particular fields. For example, Harvard Law, Wharton School Of Business, MIT's Computer Engineering, and so on and so forth. A degree from harvard, or columbia or MIT is gonna run you $200k. Roughly 40-50k/academic year. Same as full sail, except full sail is a 1 year program.

As I had mentioned before, although I can't knock Full Sail because it did put me in my position, I did not say its a pre-requisite for getting into the engineering field. There are far cheaper schools than full sail, and they all teach you the same basics. Personally, I dont think anyone coming out of Full Sail is more better off than anyone coming out of IAR (institute of audio research) in new york.

studios may be dying but the actual art and skill required to make a good mix are still alive and well.. there will always be a demand for that skill

I couldn't agree more. As far as engineers go, the ones who make the most money are the mixers. So these rappers can record in their basements all they want, but those labels are gonna take that trash and send it to the top engineers to make it sound right sonically. A skilled mixer will always be in demand. Recording engineers, not so much.