FREE beats at illmuzik? Your thoughts here

[5th Sequence]

-- FREE beats at illmuzik? Your thoughts here --

Aright so this is my .02,

There is a general principle in the online world of selling beats. Traffic = exposure = money. We can have the illest beats at illmuzik but without a lot of traffic from actual artists (we have enough producers) then times will be slow and times will remain slow as far as selling beats go.

The beat network is a great idea but it needs to attract our target audience which is artists that need beats.

In my experience with soundclick, and many other sites online that are music related, MC's look for beats they can use for free. now i know many of you are cringing at the thought of giving away a beat for free. Think about how many beats you actually have right now that you think are tight. Will you sell 10 of them this month? Could you afford to set one aside for promotion? If putting one dope beat up as a free download would attract more of our target market-- our beat hungry mc's --to listen to the rest of your beats, would that be worth it?

In my opinion yes, it would. MC's search for free beats, but they still want dope material. There is a bigger audience for people specifically searching for free beats than there are people looking for beats they are willing to buy. BUT, getting the people to hear the beats in the first place (VIA a collection of dope free beats to attract these artists) is the first step to being heard. Then the rest of your beats have a better chance of being listened to, and ultimately selling something that you have available. Artists may be set on getting a free beat and in the process, stumble upon that dope beat someone has available and really want it. It would be traffic that we would have NEVER gotten if we didn't have the free beat to attract them there in the first place.

I fucked with one of the soundclick mp3 player promotions a few weeks back. I switched which beats got played and just monitored the progress. The beat/info on the soundclick player that got the most traffic (like 3X as much traffic) was the one that was a free download. It was a cool beat, but not my personal favorite. The idea was to get them to at least click it... and if they liked it than they would go to the page.

It worked. I got several more beat inquiries from people interested in getting other beats when I ran the free beat as opposed to an even doper beat with an actual description and price. You can argue whether it was related to having a free beat available but a 3 fold increase in listens appealed to that larger audience that exists out there.

If we producers set aside a dope beat for free download, I think it would attract more of the right type of audience. Yeah there will be a ton of people that will be here only for the free beat, but who cares? It will also attract new business, because some of the MC's will crave the free beats, but then hear the other ill shit we have to offer. The prices are already competitive, all illmuzik needs is more traffic and this place would be all we need.

Illmuzik in my opinion stands as a better production forum than a lucrative beat selling site. We need targeted traffic, we can't just have a producer cockfest and post our shit expecting results you know? I dunno, one or 2 free beats used as a focused promotional tool would be beneficial for everyone.

I mean how many active members do we have on the board that could contribute one single beat? There should be a big icon on the main page so MC's can easily find it and listen. Then based on what they click they can hear "more like this" or hear "more from this producer" and it can recommend where to go next.

I didn't put this in the title but..

We should throw out ideas on how to get more traffic here and transform this place into a busy market. I love illmuzik as a forum, but we should embellish on the business end of things and give it a try. What do we have to lose? If we try and fail then we are right back where we started. It starts with brainstorming ideas to get our targeted traffic out here.

Other ideas for getting illmuzik known to artists:

1. An illmuzik VIP soundclick that creates a monthly 8-10 minute track of 1 minute snippets of beats to be listened to. Plus it Should host the best of the best of the free beats Maybe 20-30. There should be hella pictures and links that link back to illmuzik so they come to the site.

**For more FREE beats click here **to hear beats from our full catalog click here, etc ** Using a free beat? Enter the contest and win 5 Professional beats.. $50.... a trip to jamaica, etc you get the idea

2. Contact an online rap community board and do a forum wide collaboration of the best of the best. Basically an online mixtape, but for us the sole purpose would be for exposure. A 15 track album with free beats provided from varied producers and we work with another rap sites top artists. It's basically advertising illmuzik and more producers to an entire other network that is already our targeted audience.

3. Host rap contests for the free beats. MC's can rock a free beat and submit the track. Monthly (or quarterly at first), we producers can all vote on what mc made the best track and they win something (maybe some more beats? something of value though).

I dunno, corny shit like that works though. Forget your prior notions of being too uptight to try and get your music heard. You may have too much pride in your work to do so, but realistically sales aren't consistent when we sit back and expect MC's to find us. Let's make it easy for them to find us, lets invite them over to kick it the bottom line is traffic = sales.

I sold a beat today in a studio session that was basically the same process but in person actually. I invited a local group over and they wanted to hear more beats. I played the ones i had set aside from them, then later i said i had some other shit but i'm trying to sell it though. I Played the beats that were considerably doper and they insisted on buying one of them. I didn't do that on purpose, but I'm not about to give away my best shit either. Once they get listening they want to hear more.

You guys ready to make money? Thoughts and feedback lets hear it

 

[Relic]

I have to go back and finish reading but you can already get free beats off the site by going to any producer page track and saving the target and down loading that way. M3U's are dl'able.

Good read so far, cool ideas.

 

[Griffin Avid]

I think the number one problem with sites that sell beats is that they are set up by...producers who want to sell beats.

So the general theme is This is a place for PRODUCERS (to sell beats)
as opposed to a PLACE FOR EMCEES (to buy beats).

1. Why is there no FORUM FOR EMCEES?
To battle, to share, to post rhymes...to post flicks....to show their writing spot.
To build about their influences and passions. Business links for networking and information about events and such.

2. When beats have a scaled price, I (as an emcee) assume the best beats cost more (logical) so I never check beats under a certain amount.And once I hit the top amounts and don't hear big singles the site loses credibility and I stop trawling through beats.

3. For *most* producer sites, anyone can join. I mean you're paying a fee to get down and it's a business so the beats will always vary greatly in quality. Might as well stick to Soundclick/myspace/anywhere beats are...
If you could A&R the site and create a serious system of rankings, that could set up proper tiers and eliminate the tedious fishing through 100 *okay* tracks.

4. The thirstiest emcees are the ones on the way up and trying to improve their skill. He's not making an album, he's trying to get nice- and he wants to do it over the hottest beats he can...for free. I mean he aint a Rapper selling his rhymes so...that's the majority of cats looking for beats. They see nothing but price tags and do the same thing- bail back to myspace and soundclick etc.

5. From an emcees perspective- you're a nobody. I'm doing justice to your hustle by going out there over your beats and spreading your name too. If we are both at ground zero then we should be grinding together. Why am I paying you hundreds for a track? Am I making hundreds from our track together?

6. There's also the Supply and Demand issue. No need to elaborate further.

In the end it's about getting in the head of an EMCEE. Already you're talking about free beats as a gimmick. I don't know why giving peter a beat for free would help me sell one to paul.
You'd have to have a discount/coupon system where the more beats you buy, the cheaper they become -and that's site wide, not producer specific. So the more an Emcee spends the better. Even a sampling of song lyrics could be part of your profile.

Jumping a bit, but I see a lot of producers rant about emcees not wanting to buy beats. Funny how producers don't want to invest in their tools. When it comes to pirate, illegal downloads, cracked software and such, producers have every justification on why stuff should be free, but when an emcee adopts that same stance it's a problem.

The front page for a site I'd design would showcase Emcees on the front and you'd be able to submit tracks to them. The Emcees could build a Profile of Songs and they would get deep discounts for using producers in that same network. I'd rather make tracks like I want and hunt down specific emcees that fit my style and pitch directly to them as opposed to throw a sample of my sound on the net and hope the right rapper finds me.


These producer profiles would be APPROVED BY THE SITE and have key words that would match up the to rappers you'd be able to see. If you're a generic producer who'll make anything than maybe that should be your category. And as an Emcee I could limit who is able to pitch to me through those same descriptions. So I don't put Undaground New York and get emails every day from cats pushing Derty South beats or club bangers at me.

Once you pitch, the rapper gets to rank your entries. And you can even eliminate producers by blocking ranking tiers. Scrubs need not apply.

Now the free beats become something an Emcee could start from- mostly to build his profile on. when you first join the site you get 3 tracks max to pick to download and record on. Emcees can upload a capellas and pitch remixes. It's a job posting. You pay the money up front to the site and have producers work on it. Whoever's track you pick gets the alotted money. The Emcee only gets to hear a snippet so it's not like we're all making remixes for free so he can't say I don't like none of them and have tons of demos. Now I as the producer get to look at what he's paying and deciding if it's worth MY TIME to remix/produce.

The site would also feature a store, but that's a whole nother thread.

I don't undertsand (this is a figure of speech [see my opening statements]) why we set up sites specifically pitched at producers and wonder why there is no emcee/rapper traffic.

 

[dahkter]

215Hiphop.com has a lot of beatmakers, what they did was a remix album where their top 12 producers remixed existing songs. It was pretty dope. There was a JaySki "Kick in The Door" joint that's no longer on there (too bad), and the Luchini joint is dope. Here's the link:

http://215hiphop.com/features/beats-rhymes-the-remixes-free-download-album/

If we want Ill (and it's producers) to be better known, we should simply create a dope as fuck album that people listen to and enjoy.

 

[2GooD Productions]

I don't undertsand (this is a figure of speech [see my opening statements]) why we set up sites specifically pitched at producers and wonder why there is no emcee/rapper traffic.

I couldnt agree more. Because Ill is specifically pitched at producers, is it any wonder there arent many emcees to buy beats.

 

[shadeed]

If we want Ill (and it's producers) to be better known, we should simply create a dope as fuck album that people listen to and enjoy.

Although the threadstarter and Avid have made EXCELLENT points, many of which I agree with, I'm more in alignment with consistently producing projects similar to the tape DJ Nice put together for Illmuzik.

Maybe a mixtape series and change up the styles of music with each release.

As the series grows, it will become VERY easy to get artists to submit verses for every release.

I think one of the strengths of this site is that it is not Soundclick and there is more of a community aspect.

While I agree that every producer giving one free beat for download doesn't hurt the producer, I believe that "FREE" is only beneficial when there is going to be a consistent working relationship between the producer and artist.

"One-offs" or even worse dangling beats on the site for download won't help because it dilutes the talent pool of people checking for those beats. If I'm a top-notch MC, with my very own "movement", I'm not on the internet looking for free beats, I'm looking for hungry producers that can create any beat/mood/project that I need them to, and that's what Illmuzik is.

 

[dahkter]

I'm more in alignment with consistently producing projects similar to the tape DJ Nice put together for Illmuzik.

Maybe a mixtape series and change up the styles of music with each release.

As the series grows, it will become VERY easy to get artists to submit verses for every release.

I agree, after hearing the philly tape from 215hiphop, it piqued my curiousity and gave me awareness of some dope producers which I had never heard of before.

I like the idea of a monthly mixtape, have each person submit one track, and everyone links it up on facebook/myspace/email for people to DL it.

Now - to think of some themes...

I like the idea of each person grabbing an acapella and doing there own remix (similar to what 215hiphop did)
Possibly each person contributes one original song with an unkown MC of their own that they've produced (this is Similar to what DJ Nice did)
Any other ideas?

BTW - I like 5th's intention, however I think it's better to first get more traffic here and get the producers on here more well known. After that, then we could do some MC battles using the same type of strategy as the mixtape distribution. Free beats to me are best left on an individual basis, if it works for a producer as a sales strategy (either face to face or via myspace/soundclick, etc), then more power to em. I just don't see it being a right move for Ill at this point.

My two.

 

[shadeed]

I agree, after hearing the philly tape from 215hiphop, it piqued my curiousity and gave me awareness of some dope producers which I had never heard of before.

I like the idea of a monthly mixtape, have each person submit one track, and everyone links it up on facebook/myspace/email for people to DL it.

My two.

Monthly mixtape releases would be rushed - it would also dilute the quality of each release.
Once a quarter (every 3 months) would give enough room to build membership (new producers wanting to be part of it) around each release, collab with emcees, and select the best songs to be included.

 

[5th Sequence]

That's what i'm saying guys good looks on contributing solid ideas for the discussion. You don't need to take my suggestions word for word my point is that something needs to be done instead of just coolin out and posting on the forums here. We should be active, we are all more than capable of producing dope material so getting traffic here is our bottom line.

I'm feeling all of your mixtape ideas so far. I agree that monthly would be a little too rushed.

The reason why I include a soundclick idea is because they have one of the largest communities of artists. If we are going to be an a place for artists to find beats in the online realm, we need to be in all of those places

While I agree that every producer giving one free beat for download doesn't hurt the producer, I believe that "FREE" is only beneficial when there is going to be a consistent working relationship between the producer and artist.

"One-offs" or even worse dangling beats on the site for download won't help because it dilutes the talent pool of people checking for those beats. If I'm a top-notch MC, with my very own "movement", I'm not on the internet looking for free beats, I'm looking for hungry producers that can create any beat/mood/project that I need them to, and that's what Illmuzik is.

I agree. The last thing we need is a ton of whack free beats. I also agree that top notch emcees are looking for producers that will fit their project, but how are we going to get top notch MC's here? There is nothing wrong with getting our target audience even more targeted by only wanting top notch mc's and not some untalented time wasting mc's looking for free beats. If we have a lot of traffic though, we'll draw some decent people to the site along with the riff raft and thats where we have to make the decision if it's worth even doing. Do we want illmuzik flooded with whack 15 year olds? do we want whack lil producers signing up?

If we apply a simple sales ratio that is hella toned down (general sales rates are .02%) I honestly think we'd see an improvement of beat sales if we increase our traffic. I use a half percent or a quarter percent to see what those odds would be. If we get 10,000 artists to the site at a quarter percent .0025% sales rate that's 25 beat sales per month. That's just running the numbers with a low ball sales rate. It'd be about 25 transactions spread among members. Not much, but it is more of an improvement than from before.

We need something that will attract mc's. A selected, screened catalog of free high quality beats would attract our exact audience is all i'm saying. What if all they had to do was sign up to get access to the free beats? Then we have a member that will come back. What if they got emailed everytime a new beat was added? (free or not?). We get them to the site once, we give them a reason to come back, we get more listens than we would have otherwise.

And when it comes down to it, top notch mc's that are serious enough to pay for their music are seriously outnumbered by mc's looking for free beats and every other category under the sun. We shouldn't just throw out that market though, because each individual MC is at a different stage in their "developing" career. Maybe the lesser artists come to illmuzik looking for free beats and are encouraged to take their craft more seriously by buying a beat. Out of ALL the MC's that exist that are looking for beats (hundreds of thousands i would guess? i have no idea if that estimation is ballpark with how many kids rap these days) there is percentage that would change from looking for a free beat to spending a little dough to buy a significantly doper beat if they heard it.

We need traffic.

We should also offer artist album review services. For the independent artists out there that have released there stuff they can get their music reviewed by us. You know when you read someones bio and they have the reputable reviews by whatever person or site? Well we could offer that as well. Something you have to be a registered user for with a certain amount of posts? I dunno.

We are on the right track though. If we angle illmuzik to embrace mc's a bit more than we'll see a big improvement.

 

[Relic]

Monthly mixtape releases would be rushed - it would also dilute the quality of each release.
Once a quarter (every 3 months) would give enough room to build membership (new producers wanting to be part of it) around each release, collab with emcees, and select the best songs to be included.

This is true, I think it takes us around 2 years around here to put together an album..
Im sooo behind on the StepChild illmuzik collabo, He was going through a rough spot and couldnt get to the studio to record, etc,etc..But that is still in motion guys!

Every 3 months might be a good look though Shadeed!

Ive noticed that Fade hasnt chimed in yet.

 

[Kontents]

^^^
He is observing as we speak....

 

[Relic]

Insert illuminatti eye of the all knowing here...

 

[shadeed]

My comments are in blue font.

That's what i'm saying guys good looks on contributing solid ideas for the discussion. You don't need to take my suggestions word for word my point is that something needs to be done instead of just coolin out and posting on the forums here. We should be active, we are all more than capable of producing dope material so getting traffic here is our bottom line.

You're right. This is the exact reason why I started Blowing Up From the Basement a few years ago. More interaction instead of the forums and it actually did increase membership based on one-on-one feedback that I receive from my PM box.

I'm feeling all of your mixtape ideas so far. I agree that monthly would be a little too rushed.

The reason why I include a soundclick idea is because they have one of the largest communities of artists. If we are going to be an a place for artists to find beats in the online realm, we need to be in all of those places

I agree. The last thing we need is a ton of whack free beats. I also agree that top notch emcees are looking for producers that will fit their project, but how are we going to get top notch MC's here?

Getting MC's involved is not as hard as you think lol. By getting top-notch MC's "here", are you referring to:
consistent membership -or- simply contributing vocals to a mixtape project. I was referring to the second option.
I believe there was talk previously of having an MC forum, but Fade didn't want to do it. He could provide his reasons, I forget why....

There is nothing wrong with getting our target audience even more targeted by only wanting top notch mc's and not some untalented time wasting mc's looking for free beats. If we have a lot of traffic though, we'll draw some decent people to the site along with the riff raft and thats where we have to make the decision if it's worth even doing. Do we want illmuzik flooded with whack 15 year olds? do we want whack lil producers signing up?

There's a lot of factors that lead to high site traffic that you see amongst other sites on the net. Regularly updated content such as news, video, photos, and exclusive interviews are common denominators

We need something that will attract mc's. A selected, screened catalog of free high quality beats would attract our exact audience is all i'm saying. What if all they had to do was sign up to get access to the free beats? Then we have a member that will come back. What if they got emailed everytime a new beat was added? (free or not?). We get them to the site once, we give them a reason to come back, we get more listens than we would have otherwise.

And when it comes down to it, top notch mc's that are serious enough to pay for their music are seriously outnumbered by mc's looking for free beats and every other category under the sun.

We shouldn't just throw out that market though, because each individual MC is at a different stage in their "developing" career. Maybe the lesser artists come to illmuzik looking for free beats and are encouraged to take their craft more seriously by buying a beat. Out of ALL the MC's that exist that are looking for beats (hundreds of thousands i would guess? i have no idea if that estimation is ballpark with how many kids rap these days) there is percentage that would change from looking for a free beat to spending a little dough to buy a significantly doper beat if they heard it.

We need traffic.

We should also offer artist album review services. For the independent artists out there that have released there stuff they can get their music reviewed by us. You know when you read someones bio and they have the reputable reviews by whatever person or site? Well we could offer that as well. Something you have to be a registered user for with a certain amount of posts? I dunno.

Illmuzik does album reviews, just not for every single release that comes out. When you say "we", you also have to understand that to put these things in motion and "do it big" requires a lot of time and effort, so whoever steps up to that plate would have to committ to it, good suggestion though.


We are on the right track though. If we angle illmuzik to embrace mc's a bit more than we'll see a big improvement.

Hopefully discussions like this lead to that improvement

 

[Ash Holmz]

good points 5th .. i actually started a similar thread not too long ago ... i have to say that i mostly agree with you. There is a definite lack of activity on the boards ... and by activity i mean projects and collabs being completed and strides being made on the industry and business sides of the game. It seems many are content to simply post half finished beats here and there and mainly just chat. Which is cool, but obviously u , I , and many others want more than that. But in order to that, we gotta find out what we are really trying to do. Me personally, im not looking to sell beats online, thats not my focus anymore, Im into putting out completed projects and gaining recognition and building my "brand" as a producer and an artist and establishing strong relationships with other music-"business" minded cats... selling beats to some guy i dont know is not really in the plans for me. Im just looking to work with the best talent the I can find, whether its a money situation or not.

I do agree with the fact driving more traffic is a good idea.. i think the best way to drive traffic would be to offer more site content. Basically the forums are 95% of the site. More features, interviews,reviews,writeups,news, exclusive content, and articles would drive more traffic to the site, but then again to do that its gonna take more than fade doing it. There has to be some kind of staff/contributors helping him.

 

[LDB]

There has to be some kind of staff/contributors helping him.

And there's lies an issue in itself. I see dudes happy as hell to make it to ILL muzik staff and my question is for what? To sweep up forum threads? That can't be what becoming staff is all about. Instead of sweepers we need a few builders!!!!!!!!!

It's funny that this topic or one similar comes up every few months but nothing new jumps off.

Like Ash, I say "to hell with selling beats", lets do projects. I'm doing what I can to spin a few peoples songs that I meet on ILL but that only goes so far. Right now there's no face to put with the music. We need to have some SERIOUS networking going on here. Dudes need to get up out of there comfort zones and catch a flight, or drive to meet other members that are trying to make shit happen.

I have this video DJing thing jumping off right now. MP3's are cool but I'm trying to take my dj gigs to another level. One of the DJ's in my crew went down to Houston this weekend and show'd of our VJ rig and locked down a contract to put out Video Mixtapes chop'd and screw'd style.

It's time to think outside the box. It's time for the members here that are serious about making some noise to get together, say no to hate and make shit happen on a "real life" level!

 

[eldiablo]

Dudes need to get up out of there comfort zones and catch a flight, or drive to meet other members that are trying to make shit happen.

!

yo drama i will be in atl very soon doing shows and whatnot. we gotta hook up !!

i got illz back for whatever she needs. i havent been around alot lately cuz ive been so busy. but if anything needs my attention relic has my phone #

pe ace

eldia

 

[Ash Holmz]

ur absolutely right ldb .. the game is evolving ... imo if ur still just postin beats tryin to sell online imo ur waaaaay behind the curve... theres so many diffrent types of new media outlets emerging.. im sure shadeed could atest to that as well. Im just tryint to catch up at this point after having my head in the ground for a long time. Im getting there, hopefully in a month or two i can be where i need to be and maybe even ahead of the curve. Imma quick learner though, and thanks in part to cats like u, shadeed,god, im really getting my promo game better. What im realising is that promo, publicity, and creating aawareness is just as much of an art as the music is. Maybe even more so. In fact MUCH more so. The music is the easy part.

 

[Kontents]

You don’t have to be staff to contribute to the site outside of the forums. People need to understand that outside of Illmuzik we all attend to our own personal lives and what not. Illmuzik can be built by every single person here if they just make the effort.

Drama you made a thread for dropping techniques on mixing and mastering and everyone put feedback on it. I've made Tutorials and threads on music theory and so forth as many of the other members on here have contributed as well. Its all about participation, if you want to see change then lend the hand. Staff and Mods are here to oversee the growth of illmuzik and keep shit inline so we don’t stray into a site with nonsense on it.

The beatnetwork will grow with time as does everything and if not... then at least we tried. If people visiting the site to buy beats is the problem then start advertising it on other sites and your myspace. If you have a soundclick page then have a link in it to the beat network to get people to come over and check it out.

This is what sets us apart from the other sites is because we are mature enough to talk about what can be done instead of whine and moan about what’s not being done.

 

[BROUSSARD BEATS]

on the real i like this site ,I coming here peek in the door and say yep the room is clean, they move some sofa's and chairs around and add some beds, but it still smells the same
sup fade then im out
i see no stats on beat selling
but i did not know this was a site to sell beats

 

[5th Sequence]

I don't frequent this site as much as I used to when I first joined. i think the only reason why I don't frequent this place as much is because I'm personally trying to get my music in the position to be heard, and ultimately sold. you guys are exactly right, the main function of illmuzik at the moment is like a chill ass producers lounge. I just think if there is a beat network section than that means the intent is for us should be to try and sell beats. If we had traffic and it was all good we wouldn't consistently be bringing it up every few months.

As far as not concerning ourselves with selling beats online, that's to each's own. I don't want people to get the impression that all we should focus on is online sales and not network in person. Online sales will only help you pay some bills or supply some sort of additional income for you. real solid networking, securing placements and becoming known to the people that are in a position to help you in this music business is what matters in the end.

Shadeed you've put in amazing insight into the industry and have provided the platform we have all followed in one way or another with your articles. As a member of this website, I would like to see us all prosper. This won't attract all the high profile MC's, but then again which site specifically does that already?

I've let go of the notion that being an "online beat seller" is for kids or amateurs, or is unprofessional. You can call it whatever you prefer, if I could make a substantial amount of money selling beats online, and do it consistently? I would do it in a heart beat. My thing is this. I think all of us can agree that our offline careers matter more than our online ones do. That's how I personally view it anyways, but if i could make money with the online presence as well as separately pursue my offline career goals (with different beats than what I'm selling online) then i'll do that. Have my cake and eat it too if i can you know?

We would need a revamped community participation aspect to create the site we invision. In one way or another, more reviews/interviews/battles/mc section/whatever else all costs time and effort to do.

Goodpoints