Does Dre really produce?

[Fury]

MY turn......Dre isnt great

 

[berserk]

he's the modern day burt bacarach

 

[bigdmakintrax]

Hey man I made my comments earlier in the thread.....it seems like Dre is being put above other producers only for these certain aspects (works with live musicians, composes and arranges, puts it all together) and separating the other producers such as Pete Rock and Primo, equally as skilled(in the art and craft of HIP HOP PRODUCTION) and if they wanted to they could possibly do the same...(NOT COMPOSING LIKE MOZART, OR CLASSICALLY TRAINED blah, blah,.that has absolutely nothing to do with HIP HOP PRODUCING..or qualifying to be one ha)....I do not think that the criteria listed above disqualify the producers from being producers because they dont work with people that can do live riffs, or play bass on the spot....if thats the case then going by what you are saying about 90% of hip hop producers that we know of are just beatmakers.....just because Pete Rock or Primo or any other Dope Hip Hop producer( and yes they are PRODUcERS) thats been around just about as long as Dre comes to the final product ..if you are looking for anything close try ISSAAC Hayes or Quincy Jones...but they not hip hop ok.....I think that just because you trained in music you got this thing that you separate yourself from just Plain old HIP HOP producers or are better than those who arent or have some edge in your music, thats what Berserk was sort of getting at....with that view you defeat the purpose and original base of the genre....Hip Hop producers are producers especially with some of the names previously mentioned that already labeled that from hip hop history we cant go redefine what they are or what they are doing because they dont live up to our view........I know plenty of dope musicians, that know theory etc making hip hop but they dont have this type of view because they understand the roots of hip hop...and they dont go back and minimize or trivialize good solid production.........it could be true that knowing all of the theories and classical musical training set you apart in some way....but the same exact methods aside from Dre humming a tune or getting a live musician to play it and arrange it are the SAME exact concepts any of the other Legendary producers or aspiring producers use after they have gotten the sample,...select the right sound from a soundbank on their motif or module, listen to a record find the riff they want and decide to put the song down.....there is absolutely no difference......I just want to put that to rest.....Pete Rock, Primo are Just as much producers as Dr. Dre.......many of Dre's creations are straight 4 bar loops, many sampled vinyl and many of the melodies are just interpolated from existing funk and soul grooves if you really know music and funk....not a whole lot of originality there......even though he is dope.........many times he takes a loop and builds on it...just the same way any othe producer would or he finds a sample that is already existing and has that as a template for a live musician to play over and alter slightly so he can use it.....the same way a pure samplist changes the pitch, time stretches or alters a sound or chops and arranges (all on his own though) or like you find a lot of today replay some part such as the bassline, Pete rock was about the first producer filtering basslines and chopping and replaying them.

Like I said I think what a beatmaker does is when you are putting a song together, without any regard to an artist, a vision or project just making beats hoping there will be and artist that your pre-produced beat could work for....a beatmaker can easily become a producer once they start producing...ie working with artists, putting together songs, writing hooks and finishing the process....doing all those things make you a producer...I said this many times....a beat is only 50% of a project....the artist completes the vision.

a producer is one who is applying concepts either from his pre planned vision, for and artists or particular project, finding samples, sounds (live or from samples)......in other words building a song from the ground up with a particular pre planned result.......
.it doesnt matter about the process in defining what you do......we all know what production is about....

 

[trinidad]

Big D i c u kinda got to what i was getting at In an earlier post i mentiond dre is like a Barry White of a quincy jones for the matter because his role now is mostly arrainging and just basically putinng everything together, However i htink dre did help with some people like storch cuz his stuff alone is a lil ehh.. get it popin naw, and u got me was dope but i believe there was help from questlove, Ne way back to dre, his process seems to be one of two things, hears a sample and has it recreated like g thing was, or hum something ote thinks of something and have some bout play it, Also has neone noticeed dres patterns his beats sound routine at times,

ohh and in one last point like i said b4 i dont care what anyone says the outta control remix is a fuckin alchemeist beat, why is dre getting credit for it.......

 

[ManDAmyth]

ohh and in one last point like i said b4 i dont care what anyone says the outta control remix is a fuckin alchemeist beat, why is dre getting credit for it.......

Amen!

That's what got this whole thing started.

I knew about Dre's history with Daz. Where Daz said Dre was stealing shit out of his MPC....

Outta Control remix is 100% Alchemist. Anybody that listens to dude knows this.

 

[trinidad]

thats what it is as soon as read the first post thats what i was think in cuz when the joint came out im telling everybody to listen to the alchemist beat for50 n mob the ppl start saying thats dre im like fuk outta here, dude gets a lot of credit for other ppl,

 

[classic]

Wait so alchemstic produced that track and dre just bought it and threw his name on there???

fill me in??


class...

 

[trinidad]

naw thats not what im sayin class just if u listen to the track u heara alc all ova it not one bit of a dre sound the whole composition, but dre is credited to pproducing the track, I mean im not 100% on the truth of my op but just by listening ot dre and listening to alc the beat favors alc style completely, and for years thats been the issue with dre n his beats there seems to be always a someone behind the sound

 

[ManDAmyth]

I did the same thing with that track.

Look at what's transpired with the Alchemist....

1. Gets a new manager; Eminem's manager.
2. Becomes Eminem's Tour DJ.

Then Fifty Cent and Mobb Deep is rocking over a "classic" Alchemist beat.

I study The Alchemist and I know his tendency's. Outta Control remix is him.

This isn't unprecedented. My boy AL used to ghost produce for Muggs.

 

[bigdmakintrax]

If anything is sound like a Havoc beat tho....which both him and Alchemist cross influenced....(been around each others beats so long) I dunno though, if Alchemist did influence or he produced that track I do not see him letting Dre get production credits that would really make no sense.....I would look at publishing credits and see who gets a check on the beat.....that will tell you because I am sure the Alchemist would not just let go publishing on a track of that level(or more realistic his management would not do something that stupid).....unless like you said it was bought for an unknown sum.

 

[ManDAmyth]

Or is the Alchemist incorporating himself with the fam.

Notice how Dre and Em have had no comment on the 50 vs. Game beef.

My Boy Al is always lacing the Lox with shit. And with word the Lox is about to sign with Def Jam. What if Al is manuvering to get Dre's blessings. Hook 'em up with a beat showing loyalty.

So when the Lox need to be laced I'll be in business cause Dre and Em both cool with Hova. Meanwhile, Em and Dre keep 50 in check so no beef erupts.

or

I have to much fucking time on my hands... this is sad I'm coming up with rap conspiracy theories. I need to get back to work...

 

[Rhythmikal]

i think the drums of the track sound very Dre-like to me. maybe he just layed a few drums over what alch had already made.

 

[M!nd_Ctrl]

Not to knock u of dre but thats not nessiarily tru maybe respect somes when it does how ever its all a matter of opinion feel me great is only define by the person jugding, to me Pete Rock and Premo are the best eva but thats my sample orientated love and just hiphop fundamentalist view, im from jerz so the nyc hip hop is my main influence on the production tip,feel me, so my dre view might be different then yours because hip hop out of NYC relies more on a musicall comosing tip then it is sampling, as a CONDUCTOR of sort Dre cant be touched though, how eva the tru question is rather how much of the brain process is actually his, because listen to the new 50 mobb deep track undoubtably an Alcemist sounding track, while it is credited as a dre track whos the real inspiation in that case, feel me whe gotta look at it in prespective, Dre does his thing as a whole but but like truth said lookat his middle efforts before his great team was compiled and thats how i judge, (truth by the way i think mel man and some others helped with the aftermath joint) Plus read the article form the source where a few of dres ond helpers from the initial aftermath days speak bout him, they might just have inflated egos, but they can also be telling the truth also i dcant say ii know for sure all most ppls knowledge is from reading,
to end it i think Dre is a producer in the sense of how people produce other forms of music, sort of like barry white produce a lot of them quality joints form the70's but i dont think he resally plaid an instrume he compossed ehm

You can like who you want explain who plays this instrument or that instrument..., but Hip Hop wouldn't be what it is today without Dre.

"[Hip Hop] out of NYC relies more on a musicall comosing tip then it is sampling" Huh?


-Ctrl

 

[trinidad]

You can like who you want explain who plays this instrument or that instrument..., but Hip Hop wouldn't be what it is today without Dre.

"[Hip Hop] out of NYC relies more on a musicall comosing tip then it is sampling" Huh?


-Ctrl

Not sampling, thats what i ment the east coast sound relies heavily on sampling the traditional boom bap..... while out side of the east ppl sample awhole lot less, Saying HIp hop wouldnt be the same with out dre i cant really agree because personally after the death row days and before eminem what was he doing that mad him so special, and also the sound of 94' (arguably one of the best years eva, and also my favoorite year and the source's) had really nothing to do with out dre, Not to knock the dude cuz he is a legend but im sorry i just dont a gree this might be a regional thing idunno but i respect ur op.

 

[M!nd_Ctrl]

I guess we do come from two different sides. But you can't deny that Dre and NWA put this new rap/Gangster rap shit on the map and that's basically what Hip Hop today is.

I thought you were saying The east doesn't sample.

Anyways, I respect you're opinion too, I was just trying to sway you.


-Ctrl

 

[trinidad]

I guess we do come from two different sides. But you can't deny that Dre and NWA put this new rap/Gangster rap shit on the map and that's basically what Hip Hop today is.

I thought you were saying The east doesn't sample.

Anyways, I respect you're opinion too, I was just trying to sway you.


-Ctrl

Its all g my dude, yea i cant deny NWA n Dre, Im a fan dont get wrong dre is that dude he do got a golden touch, Respect is always due