Do you ever get tired of looking at a screen? WARNING LONG RANT AHEAD!

[thedreampolice]

Man, I starting really mixing records in the mid 90's (I was pretty young to be working full time in the studio) I actually cut 2" tape back in the day! Then I quickly was working on ADAT's. We never ever used a computer. Did real punch in's played everything. Then when Cakewalk pro audio came out, we started putting the stereo mix in the computer for a bit of touch up. This was like 98-99, but everything was still mixed on a real analog mixer. Here are some photos of the first studio I interned and then worked at. These are newer picts with some computer monitors.

Man I didn't even know what a plugin was. Everything was outboard and real processing.

Then I got one of the first Digidesign units, pre Pro tools, called Session 8 and I could track 8 tracks of digital audio! It was nice. I could get 16bit audio and do some non liner editing, yea not waiting for tape to rewind was awesome! Here is a picture of the thing.

Then as you guys know, I starting helping other studio's migrate to the computer. I kinda became the go to guy for audio computer advice...And was a huge proponent of an all in the box workflow, once computers could really do it all. Like 2003-2004ish Then I worked at Sweetwater and helped even bigger studios make the switch.....

But man, I have got to the point of...after all this mixing with a mouse, and looking at screens all day. I kinda feel like this is not why I got in to music. I want to touch and create it. Touching a real physical fader and doing a real mix, is magic. Now I don't think I would ever move away from a ITB solution and with things like the Slate Virtual Console (seriously don't sleep on this one guys, but learn how to use it right) you can get very stellar results from an ITB solution. But still there is magic in touching the music, in a way that the computer just can't do. Even the MPC has a screen you have to look at. Honestly I am thinking about buying a real console and a reel to reel tape machine to mix down to. It's probably just me and I am just thinking about loud here. But, maybe for my own sanity.....and honestly I have worried about that as late as well.

Anyway, not sure if you guys will read all this nonsense, but it is something I have been pondering for a while. Maybe I just needed to get it off my chest.....

 

[UNORTHODOX]

I havent been looking at the screen for music for THAT long (Since the Digi 002 or so lol) but I feel the same. But the other side is, I wouldnt want to be maintaining tape, or waiting for a song to finish rewinding just to get a preview of how the whole thing sounds ya know? I prefer this evil, and if I had the money, I'd get a Desk and some of the other toys to get real world buttons involved. I also what to hook up my comp to a projector which could help (with some other ideas), but they're way too expensive.

I understand where you're coming from and agree. I just think its the lesser of two evils so I enjoy it. Maybe look into alternatives to your monitor?

Edit: For instance, a touchscreen with a huge monitor lol

 

[slik da relic]

one of the reasons i never went to the computer is bcuz of the "mouse and kb" aspect, and the "lookin at the monitor all day" syndrome... but tape, even though its what some of us grew up on, is too slow... i guess thats why i stopped at a hardware digital workstation (Korg D16XD)... not as fast as a computer (u cant use a mouse), but with on board effects, and a built in hard drive to record on, still light speed ahead of tape.

da relic

 

[Fade]

I feel the exact same way. I remember 2" tape, ADATs, mixing boards, etc, that's where it's at because you could HEAR what you're creating. I also got into computer recording because of Cakewalk Pro Audio and it was great at first but my music started to change because of all the clicking, copying and pasting.

This is why I bought Maschine, for this exact reason. It really helps me not look at a screen so I can focus on what my ears are telling me, not my eyes.

 

[dacalion]

I've still got a ton of old analog gear but rarely use it, even when I get on my Technics, there's a computer on the receiving end.

It's all about 'convenience', 'space' and 'workflow' nowadays AND I recently discovered that a lot of top mix engineers still use 2" tape (more than I would've ever imagined in these days), so thats not a bad thing. Even though I'm 95% digital, I've always stood behind hardware and the 'unique' sound and feel that it creates.

Great topic!

 

[LouBez]

I agree with fade, thats what I love about maschine...I mean eventually you're gonna have to look up at the screen but for most of the time its just knobs and pads...I started in the adat days and their is defiantly a certain magic to using only your ears to create...

 

[Fade]

Even working on a 4-track was great because it was just me, the mixer and my turntables. Who remembers bouncing tracks!??!

 

[LDB]

ADATS sucked...though the sound was extra PHAT as in 2" tape... I have two in the garage right now that probably didn't last a year. The design was flawed. They were designed to keep you coming back so they could keep making money off of you i.e that time counter they put on them.

If I knew how to work on them myself I would probably still be using them to record certain instruments. I would then transfer what I recorded to a digital format for preservation.

As far as "screens"...you've been looking at a "screen" for a long time....even with analog gear. The screen was just a lot smaller and u didn't have to depend on it as much. With today's controllers you really shouldn't be over using your mouse or keyboard. Find a controller that works with your DAW and back the hell away from the the excessive clicks, cutting, pasting etc etc. I don't do the whole penciling shit in thing unless I'm doing some serious editing at the end. Learn how to set your velocity so that you're not penciling a human feel in!

 

[thedreampolice]

@LDB, I am talking more about doing a mix with a nice analog board. And yes, ADAT do suck!

AND I recently discovered that a lot of top mix engineers still use 2" tape (more than I would've ever imagined in these days)

yea, if you hear a rock band on top 40 radio, at least the drums where tracked to 2" tape. It is still VERY widely used.

@Fade, I had to bounce all the time but it drove me nuts. I would do everything to avoid it. I would stick guitar solo's on the vocal track (because there is usually no vocals during a solo) ANYTHING to not degrade the sound. imaging having to get a drum mix right going in because all the drums are going to one track! Yea crazy stuff! I lived on my old 4track...

 

[dacalion]

yea, if you hear a rock band on top 40 radio, at least the drums where tracked to 2" tape. It is still VERY widely used.

I just did some research and a write on a well known Mix Engineer for one of the biggest hip hop artist ever and he stills uses tape in his process. I'm not sure if it's a mental thing or not but analog just feels different to me. It has a very distinct sound.

Check this: https://www.illmuzik.com/reviews/production/young-guru-producer-spotlight/

 

[LouBez]

Fostex 4 track with a rap group consiting of 6 dudes, once I got bouncing down EVERYBODY had to have a three track vocal...whatever that shit was fun, smoking blunts in the garage RAPING the jog wheel! Lol

You guys ever "fly" hooks? I used to be deadly at that shit...

 

[thedreampolice]

ha ha, yup I have done that a bunch! Good times

 

[dacalion]

ditto...miss those days (in a way). =)

 

[slik da relic]

i lliked the 4 trk cassette machines as well (i had a Vestafire)... but at the end of the day, i KNEW i had to go to a professional studio... i dont feel that way anymore.. the 4 trxk was just for reference, looking back at it now... once the Roland VS series came out, and my friend bought a Korg D16, it was over.. thats when the digital age of recording began for me.

da relic

 

[thedreampolice]

Yea man I rocked a Roland VS for a while. They where great! But one thing pissed me off was all that "virtual" track stuff. That drove me crazy!

 

[slik da relic]

Yea man I rocked a Roland VS for a while. They where great! But one thing pissed me off was all that "virtual" track stuff. That drove me crazy!

lol... i feel u... i had NO idea wtf that meant in the beginning... i thought i had a gazillion trx to record on... technically, u do... but ohhh... i didnt know about simultaneous playback... lol... thats ur REAL trx...i was dumber than the dumbest, dumb guy when this shit was new... lmao!

i almost forgot... i had a Yamaha MD8 minidisk recorder b4 i bought the Korg... who here remembers those?.. lol

da relic

 

[LouBez]

The md8 was the mini disc 8 track right? I was one of the 11 dorks that actually bought a mini disc player...I actually wanted one of those md8's but by the time I had enough to buy one the mbox droped.

 

[Step Soprano]

Studio I'm at has an SSL, but surprisingly it is mainly used for monitoring, not for mixing. TI's new album is all in the box, despite the abundance of great analog outboard gear in the studio. Dallas has a few tape machines, but they are really just in the storage room, and used occasionally on drum tracks, which are sent from tape into pro tools. In his production room, there is no board/controller at all, just a mac, 4 screens, and about 15 keyboards. I grew up in the digital days, never used tape in my life, and would be happy to never use it, as it seems very inconvenient, but maybe that will change if I ever have to try it.

 

[thedreampolice]

Step, do a mixdown to 1/4" tape amd compare it to your itb mix. You will hear it! What ssl board is at the studio?

 

[saintjoe]

Real talk. Now I'm no engineer, so I can't speak much on that side of things but I came up on hardware in terms of beat making/production. MPC, MP7, kawai q80, roland fantoms, emu racks, digital recorders like the boss br1180 or akai dps16, other racks, synths, etc.

I went totally ITB...and it's cool, the stuff you can get now is just amazing. But this year I went and bought another emu mp7, just for the "feel" of creation that is different. I went and bought a couple synths with more on the list just for the feel and sound.

I think hybrid approach is dope, best of both. When I don't want anything to do with the computer, I can bang out on my MP7. When I want a different sound/tone I can't get with software but still want to use Maschine/software I use Maschine to sequence my external synths.

At the end of the day music is about creation and feel, so I say use whatever keeps you creative and gives you the feel you want. If you want to cut/splice tape (never done it myself) then do it man, life is too short, have fun with your art!