Racks or Keyboards!?

[EX3]

I hope everything is cool with everyone of you...

I joined a couple months back and haven't really posted much since i've yet to do anything (in the realm of producing) other than create a few song loops and breaks that i use for my cell phone answering machine and START class with berkleemusic.com (which im regreting SO FAR...but thats another story for another day).

But this isn't a post to whine , its humble call for help and guidance to any degree that can be offered.

So here's the deal... Between what i've read here, on online forums and in mags I've heard a couple of different opinions...

#1. If you want sounds and lots of sounds its better to go with racks and get a midi keyboard like an oxygen, something only used to assign sounds to keys.

and

#2. Go with something like a korg triton cause its got everything in it and it'll be cheaper.

#3. Just go with software because its got everything, More sounds than all the modules in the world, ect ect... Then i've also heard lots of times software sounds tend to sound less natural and "cheesy" sometimes.

So im confused.

In the end...Assuming this would be the cheaper option I would like to have a midi keyboard without the extras and a boat load of racks also a MPC2000xl so If i do decide to sample I can have more space to really lace the rhythm with the larger pads. (assuming the 3k and 4k dont absolutely blow it out of the water).

Im salt water swimming virgin when it comes to production but basically in the end I want to have the ability to go in ANY direction I want. From Lil Jon to Premiere , From Dre to Eric Sermon (a la "Funkorama" by Redman) from Stoupe to the Neptunes from El-p to Timbaland, from Pete Rock to Eminem, from Kanye West to Jam Master Jay and way beyond hip hop/Rap into the realm of Darkside Drum and Bass production and other Electronic genres, ect ect...

I want all these options at my finger tips because as soon as im familiar with the lab the PAINFULLY obvious fact that im an absolute MUSIC JUNKIE will shine through with some truely original sounding tracks.

But I dont know where to start man and its got me feeling , again, suffocated.

I dont want to spend time learning one way of producing when its not as effecient or cost effective as another. I understand that in order to learn which shoe fits best you have to try on a shit load of different sneakers however im sure there is a way to narrow down which pairs would probably fit best.

I guess the best way to explain what im looking for could be thrown in questions...

How do I get bass to knock... I mean really BOOM to the point where you absolutely need sub woofers to pick it up cause its so low? Is it all in the EQ or should i get a specific piece of equipment such as some sort of drum machine or get a keyboard?

How do I get my bass to groove , so it sounds like a bass hit that is stretched out while riding on a roller coaster?

Lets say I want to go with some "dirty" sounding beats, are there any machines out there that give a choice of sampling at 12 bit 16,20 and 24 bit, or will I have to get seperate machines?

Rack Modules? Keyboards? Software? Hardware?

To start I've got a decent computer.

2.4ghz 64-bit AMD FX-53 processor.
2 gigs of Ram.
2 74 gig. 10,000 RPM Raptor drives.

My sound card is garbage though, just a $70.00 basic Soundblaster Audigy 2 card with nothing but 1/8 inch jacks.

As far as budget goes, If I wanted I could go and spend 10k tomorrow on equipment and not sweat about it... I've done alot of saving for this day so I might as well go out with a fuckin bang right!? Then again part of me thinks i should start with a couple pieces and learn them first.

I dont know man, im confused...

In the end I understand that I've got to take a step in some sort of direction and im going to make mistakes because its part of life , I just NEED to feel confident that im taking a step in the direction I want as opposed to blowing cash on a P.O.S. that wont do what I want.

Thanks for any helpful responses. None is too trivial.

~ E X 3

Thanks for any helpful responses. None is too trivial.

 

[woohff]

10k=10 000? Use 1000 for alcohol. After drinking the whole 1000 and having awful hangover I'm sure you want to do something wise with your life. Then you'll get the answer...

 

[bigdmakintrax]

Ok any answer you get is relative and you gonna get a lot of different ones.....I started out on Hardware and thats what I like, I am equally as good with the software, one thing is that if you are dealing with software right off the bat I will tell you that you will probably get some better results with minimal use of time to get GOOD CLEAR and Banging Sound.....going thru a mixer you can do it too and end up with a very good mix.....but computer software nowadays lends itself the greatest thing an engineer wants....0 or little Noise introduced.....although some noise can be good for certain aspects.....and you don't to really try hard to get a decent mix with good kicks and everything.......as you would if you are using outboard mixing gear.....to me its sorta cheating but hey thats how it is nowadays......let the software do it why be an engineer....

The banging bass that tears woofers up can be achieved using a nice dose of compression and eq ...but probably the best thing you can start with is a nice tone or SINE wave or the best a good BASS SAMPLE....then use your ears and mixing....I love lots of low end......ask Formant what i did to his speakers....LOL now just kidding....

Now spending money on gear just to be spending makes now sense but if you have that much money and want to spend.....GET GEAR....and a lil software.....and some samples.......at least one turntable and start collecting a few records either from online or local vinyl sources.....


I would get either a G4 or G5 MAC.....with digi 002 for recording and mixing.....
if you don't like MACs get a Pentium 4 with at least a 3ghz processor, at least 1 gig of ram, at least an 80-100 gig drive......Windows XP ......with digi 001 (old version) or the Digi 002...the console is great too......


Now as far as music making gear.....I am listing 2 routes because I have had all kinds of combinations.......
OUTBOARD MIXER.....with direct outputs......
midi controller (Radium or Oxygen etc)
1 good sound module, there are old used ones with very good sounds you can find and they have additional room to add more sounds on a ROM...
(EMU, Mophatt or Proteus 2000 are excellent organic sound sources)
Korg Triton Rack
Yamaha Motif Rack
Korg Trinity Rack
MPC (1000, 2000XL or one of the classic pieces 3000)
a few people are using the Roland piece the MV8000 and they like that for their drums

Solution 2
A nice keyboard workstation, which generally you will not need that controller if you hook it all up correctly.....

Workstations
Triton X
any of the Roland Fantom series.....* the original Fantom has some of the sickest REAL FAT drum samples out of all of them....


and one of the drum machines I mention above.....

its really sad that none of the sequencers that come onboard are as good for programming really accurate drum sequences, and correcting like on the mpc......also its sad that they haven't implemented a good 6-8 out solution for routing just your drums.....my triton X has 6 outputs but the drums require lots of tweaking to get them to sound as punchy or as good as what I get from the 3000......but they sound ok....I never use it for drums....


anyhow thats a few of my suggestions.....

 

[EX3]

THanks alot BigD... The help will not be forgot.

~ EX3

 

[Formant024]

word D, thank god for them clipping limiters in the genelecs hehe

ow yeah...


Racks, because they save space, keys when there's no racked model available.

In all, rack and keys of the same model are ....the same. If you already have 10 keyboard in your setup you wont be anxious to add another 61keys to the lot.

 

[classic]

Start off with a rack A MIDI controller and a sequncer


class...

 

[Bloodybastid]

Do Not Get Software Unless You're Broke...you Can Just Download It Off *****...get Phantom X...get Asr-10 To Get The Actual Producing Experience. But Really It Doesn't What You Use....your Brain Is Your Best Equipment.

 

[djswivel]

as for production alone, you have many options....would you rather sequence your beats on a keyboard or a computer? If its a computer then really all u need is a MIDI controller keybaord, and rackmount gear. UNLESS, you want a really nice keyboard with semi-weighter or fully-weighted keys....Most of the midi controller keybaords have a pretty shitty feel to em (at least compared to weighted keys)


Personally, if you want to sequence on computer, i would buy the program Logic, then get rackmount gear

Korg (Triton, trinity etc)- More techno/trance/house music
Yamaha (Motif)- More for hip hop/R&B
Roland (V-Synth, fantom etc)-a little bit of both, but also quite nice for urban music


bottom line, it all comes down to what sounds u want....go to a sam ash or guitar center and check everything out....all the racks have the exact same sounds as the full keyboards only they dont have the ability to sequence tracks directly from the rack...you need software like Logic/Cubase/Pro Tools for that

 

[EX3]

Thanks , thanks and thanks again to everyone of you... Its greatly appreciated.

I hit the local guitar center today and got into a convo with a guy that worked there and i've decided to go with a Triton Extreme 88 and build from there with racks and the like...

 

[CampO]

Unless You are Rich And can blow 10k when ever you want I would go with Software First anyways a Program like Reason is good It basically has everything you need to start , it has its own sound Banks which come with basically any instrument your gonna need the only thing that you would need to buy with Reason is a Midi Controller . Do that see if you got Passion for the music and if you really wanna take it to the next level then go spend the 9500 you have left over On some Hardware Peices .

 

[The Konductor]

It really doen't matter what equipment you work with. Its all about what you can do with it. The mind is actually the key. I have a nice set up, and as of now I cant produce anything close to what the top notchers on this site are doing, such as Afrique, who works with minimal resources. I can make a beat better than the average Joe. You just have to experiment with different shit. I would get one nice keyboard(triton,motiff, phantom) and use that as your controller. Then you can buy racks from there. Racks are mad expensive too though, so don't think that route is the easiest. I got my triton for the same as I would have oaid for a triton rack brand new.

 

[EX3]

Yeah...

Like I said before I got the Triton Extreme 88 to start on... A friend of mine has an old triton that i've played on a few times and he's also told me he'll show me everything he knows about it since its the same basic interface.

As far as having a "passion" for the music goes...Well lets just say if i wasn't able to create music i'd probably kill myself if I wasn't able to supply myself with an infinite list of A list hookers , boat loads of booze and great food, of course that would just lead to a premature death anyhow but that would quite possibly be the only other choice other than a pistol to the temple... Music was the largest part of my life before this equipment now it IS my life.

and as far as software doesn't really appeal to me as much as hands on equipment because i can't exactly lace rhythm with a mouse ya know... Of course i could cut and paste till my hearts content but its not as rewarding as creating rhythms with your hands...as many of you know im sure. But of course ill end up using software regardless , i just refuse to use ONLY software as many do.

Anyways thanks again to everyone for the help...

 

[maddogg]

Yeah...


and as far as software doesn't really appeal to me as much as hands on equipment because i can't exactly lace rhythm with a mouse ya know... Of course i could cut and paste till my hearts content but its not as rewarding as creating rhythms with your hands...as many of you know im sure. But of course ill end up using software regardless , i just refuse to use ONLY software as many do.

Anyways thanks again to everyone for the help...

I understand about the software but once you hook up a midi controller reason 2.5 can be used like any other gear really you can buy pads to bang out drums on. Its not cut and paste you actually play your music. anyway the triton x is a good choice. goodluck.
Peace